Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

[Shannon Bennett]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Germ Theory, I remember reading an article in Mother Earth a few years back on the subject of poor vitamin content in non organic farms.

 

[GermTheory]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Hello,

It is not about organic or non organic farms, it is about modern varieties versus old and ancient varieties.

The economics of farming are not based on nutrition, they are based on cost to market, picked green, does not damage in transit, ripens in storage, great eye appeal, taste. All in that order.

Nobody in the produce isle wonders if the apple has similar nutrition to heritage or ancient varieties. Take the Annurca apple

Nobody is saying that about Red Delicious.

My advice... Eat local, eat heritage, eat ancient if you can.

Cripes einkorn and emmer wheat are far superior to modern wheat and they are the oldest we know (10,000 year old varieties), but they are not cheap to grow. Not cheap to grow means difficult to find.

Later,
Tom

thanks for the information on good varietals. You make an excellent point. Agribusiness does not just deplete soil, use excessive and harmful chemicals, and genetically modified seeds, theyg row only those varieties that are most productive, easily picked, least likely to spoil or bruise, without regard to nutritional value or diversity.

Trouble is, small farms are not cost effective and many consumers will be foregoing better, more nutritious food due to cost, not realizing the true cost of their choice. Hopefully, the backyard garden movement will pick up steam. If you'll allow me to boast a bit, I have over 20 fruit trees and berries in addition to many vegetables on a smallish city lot. I ate my last plum yesterday. The cherries are a memory. The apricot tree too immature. Still harvesting blueberries, limes and lemons. Looking forward to peaches, nectarines, apples, pears, grapes, persimmons,figs, oranges, more lemons, and lots more veggies. What a joy!

 

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

.......... I ate my last plum yesterday. The cherries are a memory. The apricot tree too immature. Still harvesting blueberries, limes and lemons. Looking forward to peaches, nectarines, apples, pears, grapes, persimmons,figs, oranges, more lemons, and lots more veggies. What a joy!

I think FT members should do a clinical trial to see if your home-grown food is better. Exactly what is your address?

.

 

[kiwibird]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

MMMMMMmmmm.... Sounds good!

 

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

[snip]
During a severe, prolonged pandemic, it would seem that supplements would be more important than ever since usual foods will not be available at times.

[snip]
Another point about studies, most are now funded by those with an interest in their outcome. In other words, there is much room for bias.

[snip]
One question I continue to have about Vitamin D from the Marshall perspective, is the close correlation of latitude or fish eating with the incidence of multiple sclerosis. Apparently there is a very low incidence closer to the equator or on coasts where large amounts of Vitamin D dense fish are eaten. If MS, an autoimmune disease, is caused by intracellular L shaped bacteria per the Marshall thesis, how is this geographic distribution explained?

I also wonder why those on the Marshall treatment plan exhibit such extreme photophobia?

GermTheory, these are interesting observations and questions.

Yes, when food is limited, vitamin supplements will be even more important than ever.

It is true that virtually all new drug studies are sponsored by pharmaceutical companies. I have been involved in this type of research for 25 years and have had the pleasure to work with many fine companies. These companies are definitely biased. Their only interest is to produce safe and effective drugs that will make them a lot of money. If the drugs they are testing prove to be effective but unsafe, they drop them like a hot potato. If they prove safe but ineffective, the halt the work immediately. The studies they do must pass the very tough requirements for safety and efficacy of the US FDA and similar agencies. Proving efficacy is very difficult. In essence these companies must show that their drug works for the indication under study in not one but several well designed prospective randomized clinical trials. The standard for efficacy requires them to prove that the benefits observed in the trial could not be due to chance alone meaning that the results for the drug must be statistically significant at a high level of confidence (p=<0.5). These companies know the rules and they follow them or pay a high price.

Fortunately, vitamin D3 is a generic drug and can not be patented. For this reason, pharmaceutical companies have no interest in it. Studies done on it these days are by academics as you point out. They are commonly funded by private non-profit foundations or by public health agencies like the US NIH.

You are also correct that academics, like Dr. Marshall have staked their reputation on their theories and defend them with the utmost vigor. Their theories though must stand up to the rigor of the scientific community of academic who serve as reviewers for peer reviewed medical and scientific journals as well as those who attend scientific meetings where these theories are presented and debated. The fact that Dr. Alpert and Marshall etal have been able to have their work published in respected journals means that their views have met these high standards and therefore should not be dismissed out of hand.

I may disagree with parts of their thesis as is my right. If so, I have a responsibility to say why well crafted arguments in the process. Likewise for them to defend their position requires them to provide the same evidenced based rebuttals.

While these debates can become heated at scientific Congresses where a presentation is opened for debate, it is rare for them to devolve into personal attacks on one or the other person representing a particular position. In fact anyone who stoops to this level often looses the respect of the attendees even those who might support their position.

As suggested recently by gsgs, forums like this can indeed function as a means for the discussion of scientific information in the same way that discussions of new data occur at scientific Congresses. This is an interesting use of forums like FTs and one that I think is appropriate.

We are still waiting for Dr. Albert to respond to my questions and comments regarding the Marshall Thesis. I look forward to hearing from him soon.

As for photophobia reported by those who use the Marshall Protocol, this would be an expected side effect seen in some patients using is a tetracycline class of drugs like minocycline on a chronic basis. This class of drugs becomes deposited in the skin and bones and hangs around there for a much longer time than they persist in the serum. This is probably the reason for the photophobia in my opinion. Of course, the Marshall Protocol includes instructions for those participating in it to avoid the sun both to prevent this drug side effect but also to prevent the formation of vitamin D in the skin that, according to the thesis cause their medical condition to worsen.

Grattan Woodson, MD

 

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Perhaps the only way we can evaluate that at this point, is to know about the lifestyles/occupations of people who's flu progressed to a cytokine storm. Group those with/without extensive sun exposure and then subgroups by presence of underlying conditions.

Like Dr. Chan said, this new influenza is a giant experiment where we are all participants.

.

From a thread started by Hawkeye: Australia's Aborigines at Risk as Swine Flu Outbreak Escalates


As the number of swine flu cases in Australia soars past 4,500, new research indicates that indigenous people may be more susceptible to the contagious virus, compounding an array of existing health conditions. The findings have been detailed in the medical journal The Lancet. The authors have warned of a looming international public health catastrophe.

One Aboriginal man in Australia has already died from the infection, while Native Indians in Canada have seen many cases.

Australian researchers, writing in The Lancet, have warned that the risk of indigenous groups contracting the potentially deadly respiratory disease is heightened because they are more likely to be malnourished and living in poverty.

They say the "Westernization" of diets has exacerbated health problems. Many indigenous people now eat foods loaded with excessive sugar, salt and fat.

Below is my post in response to this article. AD and I have been discussing various natural experiments that might occur during the pandemic that could shed light on the vitamin D hypothesis. Below is an example of the type of natural experiment that could be done in this regard.


Obviously this is a big concern and has been for quite a while here on FTs.

It would be of interest to compare the outcomes of AU's aboriginal people who remain in the primitive outback compared to those who live in the cities and have adopted European lifestyles.

Since these Caucasian people are dark skinned, it can be expected that those following a traditional way of life will have exceeding healthy vitamin D levels, probably in the 70ng/ml to 80ng/ml area which should provide them with protection for influenza and its complications if indeed the hypothesis that vitamin D is useful for this purpose proves correct as I hope it will.

OTOH, those who suit up everyday to go to work, remaining indoors most of the time and consume a European rather than traditional diet can be expected to have a high incidence of vitamin D deficiency.

What makes this natural experiment compelling is the fact that while genetically, the two groups are very similar their lifestyles are very different. What's more the aboriginal who lives in the city has the advantage of having access to a first rate national health system with all the bells and whistles while the outback aboriginal does not.

If there are significant differences in influenza incidence and outcomes between these two groups in favor of those living in the outback, this would be strong circumstantial evidence for their being a protective link between vitamin D and influenza.

What would be of interest is to search the literature for evidence that the assumption mentioned above that aboriginals who live in the cities have low vitamin D levels while those living a traditional lifestyle in the outback have high levels. This obviously is something that would be very important to establish when interpreting the findings of this observational case control study. What's more, if you are an industrious young investigator living in AU, you might quickly write up a research proposal for this study so that it can be a prospective case control study rather than a retrospective one. Included in the design should be a survey of vitamin D levels in a representative sample of these two groups if this data is not already available.

A prospective case control study is a more powerful research tool, second only to a randomized clinical trial giving the results of such an investigation added weight.

Grattan Woodson, MD

 

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Hi,

Here is a kicker...



Every single one of those "underlying conditions" through recent research has either been linked to vitamin D deficiency, or as in the case of pregnant woman, studies show in excess of 80% are vitamin D deficient.

It would appear the risk for both the influenza and the underlying condition are the same risk factor.

Underlying conditions appear to be a smoking gun in influenza deaths.

Tom

Great finds Tom. Please provide us with links to these references.

GW

 

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

While this post may seem to be off the topic of this thread, I would consider it more of a related diversion. Hopefully the reason why can be seen by a careful reading of the material below.

The posts regarding the differences between older varietals and those we consume today is very interesting. The notion that these heirloom plants and trees might be more nutritious in the way we understand nutrition today is a theory that is new to me and one that IMO deserves investigation.

Of course, we know very little about nutrition. This whole thread is about how inadequate the current RDA for one of the most important recognized nutrients, vitamin D is compared to what is well documented in the peer reviewed medical and scientific literature.

For the most part nutritionists have focused on tabulating what I call The Big Three, carbohydrate, fat, and protein content of food as well as their calories per serving (that is 4 and fiber is 5). What we have very little knowledge of however is the effects on human health of all the other things Mother Nature packs the food She gave us besides the big three (or five if you like).

"Man does not live by carbohydrate alone"

I too am a student and supporter of Dr. Weil. In one of his books on nutrition, he states that the cabbage family of foods contain over 38,000 separate flavonoid compounds. In fact flavonoids of various types and there are a huge variety, are one of the most common "non-nutrient" organic chemicals found in foods eaten and treasured by humans for 1000s of years. Despite there ubiquitous present in the human diet these substances are not recognized as nutrients.

What the hell do they do then if they are not nutritious and why did our ancestors select so many foods included in our traditional diet that are rich in flavonoids if there was not a reason that affected our survival? Well, the answer to this question is not known. Another anomaly!!!! I am really having fun now.

From Wikipedia:

Flavonoids are most commonly known for their antioxidant activity. Flavonoids are also commonly referred to as bioflavonoids in the media ? the terms are largely equivalent and interchangeable, for most flavonoids are biological in origin. Flavonoids are "the most common group of polyphenolic compounds in the human diet and are found ubiquitously in plants".[2]

[snip]

Flavonoids are widely distributed in plants fulfilling many functions including producing yellow or red/blue pigmentation in flowers and protection from attack by microbes and insects. The widespread distribution of flavonoids, their variety and their relatively low toxicity compared to other active plant compounds (for instance alkaloids) mean that many animals, including humans, ingest significant quantities in their diet. Flavonoids have been referred to as "nature's biological response modifiers" because of strong experimental evidence of their inherent ability to modify the body's reaction to allergens, viruses, and carcinogens. They show anti-allergic, anti-inflammatory[4] , anti-microbial[5] and anti-cancer activity.

A potential link to our thread's topic.

Here is the Wikipedia link where you can see a 2D image of the basic flavonoid chemical structure as well as learn way more about flavonoids than you ever wanted to; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flavanoids

What I find very cool about flavonoids is the similarity between their basic structure and steroid hormones like vitamin D and their precursor molecule cholesterol (Another link to the main topic of the thread, that's 2 but who is keeping score)

Cholesterol, the much maligned organic chemical is the critical substrate for all steroid hormone production in the human body including vitamin D (another tie in) that makes higher life forms (that be us) possible. Here is the Wikipedia link for cholesterol where you will see a 2D representation of this key organic chemical: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cholesterol

There is no RDA for flavonoids. We have very little idea what contribution they make to human health or disease. The fact that so many of the traditional foods we consume like tea, dark chocolate, citrus, ginkgo, cabbage, and red wine are all enriched with this compound is of great interest especially since the keepers of the RDA have not seen fit to even give it a footnote. (wait a minute, do people actually eat ginkgo?)

This is but one example of an exotic compound that is widely present in our present diet and that of the ancestors of virtually all humans that has not been recognized as a nutrient. One might ask then if it is not a nutrient that is important for human health why have our ancestors sought out so many foods that contain them and included them in our traditional diets irrespective of cultural or racial background?

This is what I mean when I say we really know very little about nutrition. Cultural evolution which includes our traditional diets are the result of natural selection just as human genetic traits are. For instance, canabalism was stylish for some people but this dietary practice sort of died out ;~> if you know what I mean.

Our ignorance about what is or is not good for us to eat then is pretty limited. This will make a scientific study of early varietals and heirloom plants and trees difficult to make much sense of because we don't know what we are looking for.

This should not stop basic research into this important question though. One way to start would be to compare the contents of "improved grains" for instance with some of the early varietals as mentioned above by Tom "Cripes einkorn and emmer wheat are far superior to modern wheat and they are the oldest we know (10,000 year old varieties), but they are not cheap to grow. Not cheap to grow means difficult to find."

Now Tom says that these "are far superior" and maybe he knows why they are and if so can help me to understand why. But maybe what Tom means is that he thinks they are better or they taste better to him. Whatever the basis of his statement the point I am trying to make (while waiting on Dr. Alpert to get back to us) is that he may well be correct but what we need is proof not opinion.

A study like this would not just look at the big three (I need to go ahead an change this to The BIG Five) but also consider everything else that differed between the "improved wheat" and the early varietals. I am no chemist but it might be possible to do this using high pressure liquid chromatography. This would be one way to do it that was popular when I was in college but today there are probably much better ways to determine the composition of a substance.

This phase of the research would simply be focused on defining the differences in chemical composition between these two strains of wheat and publish them in a catalog.

The next step would be to attempt to determine the biological effects of the compounds that differed between the two varieties and to explore what these differences have if any on human health. (I don't know how to do this but if Dr. Albert would just give me a little more time I might be able to come up with something)

The same basic process would need to be repeated for all natural foods consumed today (sorry Tang, but you are for astronauts only) where there was a corresponding early varietal or heirloom example.

Very interesting! Thanks for introducing the topic.

Still waiting for Dr. Albert. (OH, this isn't Twitter, sorry wrong forum)

GW

 

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Dr. Woodson:

Regarding studies mentioned in post #268....

Modern epidemiology began in reaction to another epidemic, says Dr. Morens. In the early 1830s, as cholera made its way along waterways from Asia towards Europe, French officials attempted to prepare their country in advance of an outbreak.

Teams of scientists were sent to Poland and Russia to observe the outbreaks there. Throughout France, coastal health agencies and new quarantine stations were established; in Paris, a network of health inspection offices was created to coordinate inspection of wells, cesspools and latrines of both public and private buildings. Despite these efforts, cholera arrived in Paris on March 29, 1832, with explosive effect?within two weeks, there were 1,000 cases, 85 percent of them fatal.

Daily newspapers published lists of cases allowing armchair epidemiologists (early FT members) to see trends in illness and deaths. "For the first time in history," write the NIAID authors, "a large-scale emerging epidemic was scientifically investigated in 'real time' using census data in a prospective population-based approach that featured analyses of morbidity and mortality stratified by age-group, sex, occupation, socioeconomic status and location."

post #1 from: http://www.flutrackers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=86553

If they can do that type of epidemiology work in 1832, why aren't we getting real-time data about illnesses today? The HIPA excuse (& other excuses) can only be stretched so far, but when lives are at stake we should be able to do better than 1832!

.

 

[tropical]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

duplicated post #273

 

[snow hope]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Even though I am only a layman in this area, I have found this whole discussion very interesting and important. But some of the more detailed discussion gets just a little bit beyond me.....

Am I correct in saying that if you have no underlying health problems and appear to be fit and well, that taking a Vitamin D supplement every day would be considered by all scientific contributors to this thread to be a sensible course of action to increase defense against H1N1?

I have started my family (ages 48,47,23,21,17) on 1000mg Vitamin C per day a week ago and expect to start on 1000iu Vitamin D (purchased yesterday) per day too.

Since reading Dr Albert's posts I have been rather hesitant about proceeding with the Vitamin D. Thanks for your contributions and hopefully your answers.

 

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

I emailed Dr. Albert yesterday asking when he might have time to respond. He wrote back with this link suggesting that the information there may well answer our inquires into the Marshall Thesis: http://bacteriality.com/

I do not expect to hear anymore from Dr. Albert on this matter but leave the invitation open to him.

IMO, the Marshall Thesis while intriguing and using the modern language of science, is without scientific merit. There is no evidence to suggest the linchpin of his thesis is true; mainly that many human cell lines are infected with a large number of bacteria. There can be no ligands produced by intracellular bacteria that do not exist. These non-existent ligands then can not bind the VDR down regulating its function. For these reasons I reject the Marshall Thesis and also declare that his recommendation against the use of vitamin D supplements is misguided and if followed could be of harm especially among those who already have insufficient levels of serum 25 OH vit D.

What is an indisputable fact is vitamin D deficiency is highly prevalent in all human societies. The VDR is the target of vitamin D and regulates many processes within the human body that affect our health and susceptibility for disease. There have been an explosion of data on both the action of vitamin D, the VDR, and common human diseases that result due to vitamin D deficiency.

I resolve then that vitamin D deficiency is the cause of VDR dysfunction in most people with the exception of the small percentage of people with VDR polymorphisms which result in the VDR being variously resistant to the effects of vitamin D. What's more, replacement of vitamin D by the judicious use of sunlight and supplements is a vastly underutilized method of improving human health. The daily dose of vitamin D3 required to obtain the benefits of this hormone is at least 12 times higher than the RDA of 400iu. This level of intake equates to a dose of 5,000iu of vitamin D3 per day from all sources including sun exposure and supplements.

The jury remains out on the benefits and risks of vitamin D supplementation at the 5,000iu dose level but IMO the data is clear; supplementation is clearly warranted and very likely to substantially improve the health of those who follow this course.

At the conclusion of a debate, a time honored practice is to ask those who have participated in it to voice their opinion on what they learned for the exercise, what position they support as a result of it and in what way if any the information they gleaned as a result of the debate has affected their life choices and behavior.

I will go first. The vitamin D problem is real and supplementation is a very good answer to it. Using vitamin D3 is the best supplement to use and the lowest dose for optimal health is 5,000iu per day. Serum levels of 25 OH vit D3 is the best way to monitor body stores of vitamin D. Levels below 32ng/ml are inadequate for bone health and those below 50ng/ml are inadequate for immune health. The healthy and safe range for serum 25 OH vit D3 levels are between 50ng/ml and 80ng/ml. There is no benefit for having levels above 80ng/ml. Toxicity due to vitamin D3 is observed in those with serum 25 OH D3 levels above 120ng/ml; a level seen only in those who supplement with doses above 30,000iu of D3 daily (from all sources) and only after 2 months at this dose. Vitamin D supplementation is not safe or effective for everyone. These include people with and unexplained high blood calcium level, a history of kidney stones, a history of sarcoidosis, those with untreated primary hyperparathyroidism and for those with renal insufficiency.

The dose of vitamin D3 for children that is safe has not been studied enough but is probably no more than half the level for adults.

I look forward to hearing from both those who have participated in this debate on this thread as well as the large number of FT members who have simply observed it. I hope you all have enjoyed it as much as I have and wish to thank The Mountain's Voice for starting this thread. It has been very informative for me.

Grattan Woodson, MD

 

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

To be fair before you judge the validity of the Marshall Hypothesis and Dr. Albert's opinions, I suggest that you take the time to view the quite excellent presentation found on http://bacteriality.com/ given by Amy Proal in China as suggested by Dr. Albert.

She makes a very good case and presents interesting data that is new to me. This data though has not changed my conclusions. I will say why later so as not to prejudice anyone.

GW

 

[St Michael]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

IMO, the Marshall Thesis while intriguing and using the modern language of science, is without scientific merit...For these reasons I reject the Marshall Thesis and also declare that his recommendation against the use of vitamin D supplements is misguided and if followed could be of harm especially among those who already have insufficient levels of serum 25 OH vit D.

What is an indisputable fact is vitamin D deficiency is highly prevalent in all human societies. The VDR is the target of vitamin D and regulates many processes within the human body that affect our health and susceptibility for disease. There have been an explosion of data on both the action of vitamin D, the VDR, and common human diseases that result due to vitamin D deficiency.

I resolve then that vitamin D deficiency is the cause of VDR dysfunction in most people with the exception of the small percentage of people with VDR polymorphisms which result in the VDR being variously resistant to the effects of vitamin D. What's more, replacement of vitamin D by the judicious use of sunlight and supplements is a vastly underutilized method of improving human health. The daily dose of vitamin D3 required to obtain the benefits of this hormone is at least 12 times higher than the RDA of 400iu. This level of intake equates to a dose of 5,000iu of vitamin D3 per day from all sources including sun exposure and supplements.

At the conclusion of a debate, a time honored practice is to ask those who have participated in it to voice their opinion on what they learned for the exercise, what position they support as a result of it and in what way if any the information they gleaned as a result of the debate has affected their life choices and behavior.

I will go first. The vitamin D problem is real and supplementation is a very good answer to it. Using vitamin D3 is the best supplement to use and the lowest dose for optimal health is 5,000iu per day. Serum levels of 25 OH vit D3 is the best way to monitor body stores of vitamin D. Levels below 32ng/ml are inadequate for bone health and those below 50ng/ml are inadequate for immune health. The healthy and safe range for serum 25 OH vit D3 levels are between 50ng/ml and 80ng/ml. There is no benefit for having levels above 80ng/ml. Toxicity due to vitamin D3 is observed in those with serum 25 OH D3 levels above 120ng/ml; a level seen only in those who supplement with doses above 30,000iu of D3 daily (from all sources) and only after 2 months at this dose.

Excellent summary, I agree without reservation.

Your summary should be rewritten as a position statement and posted as a separate thread. (IMHO.)

 

[the doctor]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Dr. Woodson:

Regarding studies mentioned in post #268....



post #1 from: http://www.flutrackers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=86553

If they can do that type of epidemiology work in 1832, why aren't we getting real-time data about illnesses today? The HIPA excuse (& other excuses) can only be stretched so far, but when lives are at stake we should be able to do better than 1832!

.

I completely agree.

GW

 

[sharon sanders]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

I moved the posts regarding grains to this thread:

http://www.flutrackers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=114278



Thanks everyone!

 

[kiwibird]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

I am happy to post my personal conclusions.

I am taking Vitamin D and giving my family 2000iu adults, 1200iu teenagers as a short term measure and encouraging outdoor activity.

It seems obvious to me that populations with low vitamin D levels have worse case outcomes from influenza. The premise for the articles advocating avoidance of Vitamin D does not seem logical, ie that an ill immune system would choose a logical immune reaction. The "proof of the pudding" would be that adherents of this low vitamin D regime would "be cured" and the authors have not shown this.

I cannot thank enough Mountainvoice for starting this thread and everyone else for exploring the subject so thoroughly, especially Dr Woodson.

 

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

After watching this discussion evolve, my personal observations would be:

This is another success for the FT-style communication. We're clearly harnessing the power of a unique communication media to bring about valuable research, discussion, and important conclusions - all in the blink of an eye compared to conventional methods.

I have learned that Vitamin D is not simply another menu item, but rather one of many important players in a long list of inter-related human biological systems.

Our assumptions about the causes of disease are often wrong and modern science needs to revisit some of their assumptions. Even modern science may not have reached a comfortable concensus, so clearly more research is needed.

Modern lifestyles, while beneficial to our health in many ways, continue to contribute to illness, e.g., lack of sunshine creates Vitamin D deficiency. So it would follow that treatment research should include examining modern lifestyles, not just drugs.

While there may be some debate about required levels of vitamin D, recreating the levels achieved by our ancient ancestors is probably a safe target (by sunshine and/or supplements). It appears to me that Vitamin D inputs of less than 5000 IU per day may be inadequate and the lifeguard utilizes about 10,000 IU per day only on the days he/she is actually working outside. So somewhere within the 3000 to 5000+ range is probably safe and beneficial.

Vitamin D deficiency is a serious global problem, but since the easiest solutions (more sun exposure) run contrary to some cultural practices, either the moral authorities within that culture need to fashion a compromise solution or there needs to be widespread supplementation.

This is one health message that not only will I share, but I think will have a widespread accepting audience.

We're very fortunate to have such informed people participating in the discussion. Thanks to everyone.

.

 

[AlaskaDenise]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

There was an interesting chart at a link to the Human Microbiome Project on Dr. Albert's link. It gives the details on the locations of all human bacteria.

HMP Categories: Body Sample Site

Body Sample Site........ Count Percentage 
HMP Categories: Body Sample Site
Body Sample Site Count Percentage 
  Urogenital tract 83 13% 
  Oral 96 15% 
  Blood 4 1% 
  Skin 110 17% 
  Nasopharyngeal 1 0% 
  Airways 53 8% 
  Eye 1 0% 
  Gastrointestinal tract 297 46% 
  
 

Unclassified: 10

 

[The Mountains Voice]

Re: Cytokine Storm & Vitamin D relationship?

Contact for First Nations groups;

http://www.nativeweb.org/resources/nations_web_sites_information/canada/

This should be of benefit for those wishing to alert First Nation groups about influenza and vitamin D deficiency.

Tom

This has been such an amazing journey into what can be accomplished by good people, stripped of personal desire, and political posturing.

I would like to personally thank everyone who has contributed. You have quite possibly saved the lives of some of my friends and family. In the past few weeks I have been quiet. Not only here, but in my personal life. It has been interesting to me that the people I normally interact with in regards to what have become gentle nudges of preparedness, and have sort of tuned me out - have actually perked up an eyebrow when I talk about Vitamin D Supplementation, and it's very powerful benefits, and protective qualities.

So I at least have something to promote that seems accepted to a greater degree, and will hopefully make a difference, even when the dumb sheep don't/won't listen to anything else.

I have chosen Tom's post to reply to after such a long silence, because it seems like the appropriate subject at this point in time.

It is Time..... to get the word out.