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Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Nurses Want More Training and Social Supports

Josh Pringle
Thursday, February 28, 2008

One out of five Canadian nurses say they are "not at all" ready for an infectious disease outbreak.
A broad-ranging University of Ottawa study of front-line health care workers finds 21 per cent are "not at all prepared" for a natural disaster.
The study asked workers about their ability to cope with large scale health crises.
Almost three-quarters of nurses said they were "a little" or "somewhat" prepared for an infectious disease outbreak.
The report entitled "Caring for Nurses in Public Health Emergencies" finds nurses want more training and social supports to help them be ready to deal with future emergencies. Nurses told researchers they need more in terms of human resource support and social support to help them prepare and train to deal with a pandemic or disaster.

http://www.cfra.com/headlines/index.asp?cat=3&nid=55481
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Thanks for your articles Laidback Al

In qu?bec in 2003 I have lobby in the Public Health Institute to recruit elderly nurses and GP's. I dared to post in a prominent paper to recruit 72,000 volonteers.

The Qu?bec Gov now has more than 80,000 volonteers.

Maybe something similar should start in US.

Once retired, children are raised, you have an expertise, and you surely can get your shoulder at the wheel for your fellow beings.

Maybe we should write an article for the MSM, it worked here you know.

Snowy
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

More on the Canadian Nurse Study
Source: http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=a3c91df5-77c6-46bb-84c8-0c2d1d2b1eb3&k=47417

No one ready for next crisis, nurses warn
Workers and system unprepared for outbreaks, disasters, researchers told
Joanne Laucius, Ottawa Citizen
Published: Thursday, February 28, 2008

Almost five years after SARS, a broad-ranging University of Ottawa study that asked front-line health workers about their ability to cope with large-scale health crises found that many still don't feel prepared to respond.

And many have little confidence in the system's ability to handle a public health emergency.
The study, to be released today, began about two years after the SARS outbreak of 2003 claimed 44 lives in the Toronto area.

It took more than three years to complete and included five focus groups comprised of 100 registered nurses, registered practical nurses and nurse managers.

The sessions were conducted in Ottawa, Toronto, Vancouver and Halifax between November 2005 and February 2006.

The study also included a web-based survey of 1,500 emergency and critical-care nurses.
About half had worked during an outbreak of an infectious disease, such as C. difficile, since the SARS outbreak.

The study's range was from coast to coast, but perceptions were the same across Canada, said lead researcher Carol Amaratunga, a professor with the Institute of Population Health.

The study found that while almost three-quarters of the workers said they were "a little" or "somewhat" prepared for an infectious disease outbreak, 18 per cent were "not at all" ready.

Meanwhile, 21.1 per cent were "not at all" prepared for a natural disaster; 69.4 per cent for a chemical weapons attack and 69.5 per cent for a biological weapons attack.

"Three years post-SARS, they really didn't know what was happening, even in their own institutions," said project co-ordinator Patricia Thille.

The findings are important, because there will be another public health crisis like SARS, she said. "It's just a question of when."

During a crisis, the health of front-line workers must be protected to meet "surge capacity" needs.
If it's not, the health care workforce will shrink due to illness, quarantine and refusal to work, the study found.

But the nurses surveyed said they were already working at maximum capacity.

"The terrible secret is that there is no surge capacity," one participant told the researchers.
Among the issues identified:

. Of three emergency rooms examined by researchers, none had a plan or requirement for regular fit testing of masks and other safety equipment such as gloves, gowns and face shields. One nurse commented that most workers had been fitted for a mask, but the testing certificate had expired six months ago.

. While doctors are provided with "scrubs" in most hospitals, nurses have to provide and launder their own. Wearing uniforms out of the hospital and bringing them home to be laundered poses a risk to the public and workers' families, the study noted.

. Support for quarantined workers was an issue, especially the delivery of food, medications, masks and other protective equipment to workers who have no family member to bring them these items.

"One person was quarantined and had no groceries, no one to walk the dog," said a participant.

. Workers also reported getting conflicting orders.
"I was in quarantine, called Friday afternoon and had a three-way phone conversation. Under no circumstances should I come in," said one nurse.

"Someone would contact me from Public Health. Didn't happen. Said they would send food. Didn't happen. Next day called and asked me to come in."

. More than 27 per cent of the workers reported having multiple jobs. Many nurses work on contract and as casual and part-time workers and have no guarantee that they would be compensated for lost time if they get sick.

"I am part-time. I have no benefits," said one participant. "Should I put myself at risk? What if I get sick for a long time?"

. About 90 per cent of nurses in the field of emergency and critical care are women, and many found their duty as parents and spouses conflicted with their duty as nurses.

About 53 per cent of the workers in the study had dependent children living with them. Many were caught between their duty to care for patients and personal and family safety.

While existing guidelines mention vaccinating children, spouses and dependent children of health care workers, it would not be logistically feasible or ethically justifiable to do so, according to the Public Health Agency of Canada.

Some of the nurses said concern about infecting a relative may be enough to tip the balance between their commitment to nursing and their family responsibilities.

. Some nurses reported that managers and other nurses kept their distance from front-line SARS workers, leaving them feeling angry, demoralized and abandoned.

"In our hospital, we were told that our hospital would be a SARS hospital, and within two weeks all the management offices were moved to another location - another hospital." said one participant.

"We were told it was all because of amalgamation and it was going to happen anyways, but it sent a strong message."

Another noted that no one would talk to emergency nurses.

"Co-workers stigmatized each other - and moved to the next table."

Ms. Amaratunga said her research team was impressed by the high degree of professionalism of Canada's nurses.

"They care a great deal about their profession, but they are caught in divided loyalties," she said.
The report will be sent to occupational health and safety committees at hospitals, as well as being posted on the Canadian Policy Research Networks website.

There had been a significant investment in emergency preparedness since SARS. The gaps in the system can be fixed, but they need attention, said Ms Amaratunga.
"We can do better and we should do better," she said.

SARS came to Canada five years ago this spring, noted Ms. Amaratunga. "This is a good time to reflect back on our progress."


In their own words:

Some of the comments made by participants surveyed as part of a broad-ranging University of Ottawa study that asked front-line health workers about their ability and that of the system to cope with large-scale health crises:

"Isolation, abandonment - friends, family, bus passengers, co-workers, community, management - it's like the plague, like a mark on your door, because everyone in the neighbourhood knows you work at the hospital."
.
"Anticipate that not all of your health care workers are going to work - you need to know who's going to stay on board, and need to figure this out at the very beginning."
.
"A warm body isn't much use if they don't know what needs to happen."
.
"Lots of guilt - should I have chosen a profession that would have protected me better? The guilt stays. If I bring it home and they (my family) get sick, it's because of me."
.
"In terms of going to work - I don't have the right to make those decisions on behalf of my children and my husband."
.
"We need preventative medication and vaccines for the whole family, not just the health care workers."
.
"You're probably going to get me coming to work if I know my children are vaccinated."
.
"I want to be able to change and decontaminate before I go home."
.
"During SARS, people were making decisions up high and you were sort of there in the trenches."
.
"I called up infection control and asked someone to come and watch activity response and was asked, 'Can we do it in September?'"

? Ottawa Citizen 2008
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

As a health care worker with some 20+ years of ER experience I thought I would put in my two cents re: the issue of "Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic"

I will use my local hospital as an example. We have a 150 bed hospital in this town (my hospital) and a 400 bed hospital (other). I am intimately familiar with my hospital so I will give some observations.

Our ER is staffed by 1 physician 7am-7pm and one 7pm-7am
one Physician's assistant 12noon to 12 midnight

We have anywhere from 3-7 nurses working in the ER depending on time of day. There are 15 ICU beds that are all full 90% of the time. There are 6 ventilators, 4 are in use 90% of the time.

If 10% of our nurses or the PA do not show up for work due to A) illness B)fear that they may get illness C)fear that they may bring illness home to family D)fear that they are sick and don't want to infect community E) fear of violence
then we could continue seeing out usual patient load (no influenza, not even seasonal).
A)If 20% of the nurses don't show up
B)one doctor

then the ER closes!
the volume of patients goes up 40% (seasonal influenza or drunken holiday)
the ER goes on diversion (closes)

If the ICU gets full (approximately 2 more critical patients)
the Hospital goes on diversion

If we have 3 new patients on a ventilator or if one of the approximately/Pulmonologists are out sick
the Hospital goes on diversion

The point being is that in my small city in a sophisticated country with the availability of all the medicines, supplies, expertise etc. it will take almost anything to bring the system to a halt.

So it almost doesn't matter if the nurses are brave, heroic, dedicated or wise and scared. This machine will come to a halt very quickly. I don't think this would change if 100% of the hospital staff wore a Bio-hazard suit with an oxygen tank. They will still be vulnerable at home, coming to work, shopping etc.. If 100% of the staff had a 100% effective vaccine the system will still crash and burn if more then 3 critical patients come in or a >40% increase in ill patients. Then what happens?

If our hospital is on diversion then most likely we are a mirror to what is going on throughout the state. Patients will come to the ER anyway because that is there only option. When the ER is full and people are refused care violence will ensue. No one wants to talk about it but that is what will happen. If a family sits in the waiting room meant for 30 and there are 100 people all ill or scared it is like dry kindling. If a 5 year old coughs up blood in the waiting room or turns blue I can guarantee that the family will push their way in (I would, wouldn't you?). Then what?

Once there is a breach then the dedicated staff will either no longer show up for work or the hospital will lock down. No one in or out.

I think it is not a matter of if but when. My thoughts are how do we save as many as possible? If we retreat do we have a fall back position? or will it be a route? If the hospital closes for a week or two can it ever re-open? If we pull back our trained staff to save them will there be any equipment? Will the hospital be looted? Will the medical staff who "left" be sanctioned or applauded?

I would like to know if anyone in any medical community has a fall back position where the staff can rally and rebuild?
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Welcome Gullwing. Excellent post.


Well said. Yes, Gullwing, excellent.

Are not some of your questions addressed by the articles, reports and stories that arose from the hospital experiences in New Orleans and Katrina?

Can we not foresee what will happen, in general terms, during a pandemic from what did happen in New Orleans?

J.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Welcome, Gullwing.

I wish that I had a good answer for you but, I do not. I do know that where I am currently living, the biggest hospital has a disaster plan with two teams that staff must belong to. A Team reports first and B team relieves them. Not to report will result in termination. Sounds great on paper but it does not address any of the very real scenarios that you have suggested...

The devil is in the details. Many disaster plans do not mention the details of how we will be able to do this.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Doesn't sound like a winning plan to me. Sort of like a General who threatens to shoot all the soldiers who leave their post. If your position is over run then you lose all of your soldiers. Those that leave will not come back. For a CEO to mandate such a plan they would have to be confident that if everyone held to there positions then the ER could batter such a storm. I am not at all confident. My efforts will be to convince my collegues that there needs to be a safe place to fall back to.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Doesn't sound like a winning plan to me.
1.Sort of like a General who threatens to shoot all the soldiers who leave their post.
2.If your position is over run then you lose all of your soldiers.
3.Those that leave will not come back.
4.For a CEO to mandate such a plan they would have to be confident that if everyone held to there positions then the ER could batter such a storm. I am not at all confident.
5.My efforts will be to convince my collegues that there needs to be a safe place to fall back to.
Hi gullwing,
things that seems unbelievable, in certain times, happens.
Obviously the plan would be driven by the circumstances.
If we speak about a reaction to an very serious deadly pandemic, it could be treated like in a war situation - the standard civil procedures can't be fit in such event. Your comparision of a General was quite correct:
1. If a hospital will be infected, I doubt that the staff would be granted to leave it.
2. The staff will not be at lose because they will be bottled in from the outside by armed sanitary line forces (at the begining when the pandemic would not be everywhere).
3. Yes, the lucky ones leaved previous the isolation/quarantine period
4. Well, they must set up some sort of plan, even if it's not realistic to cope on, without much more staff, and "stuff"
5. A safe place to fall back to will be doubtful, a vault under the hospital, etc. What if in that vault sip somebody infected?
The sip measure was individual isolation.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

I am a nurse of 35 years, i started w/ the gals from Viet Nam as my role-models, most of them had spent time in TB wards of the 50's and 60's.

Gullwing your scenario is well worded and politely stated. I have watched The Morning After, Resident Evil Apocalypse Now, Pearl Harbor, The Stand, 28 Weeks Later and other disaster movies. Lock down of the facility and security should be the first and primary move taken.

I do not intend to participate and will stand back. I cannot change events nor do I feel Called to do so. I can take care of my immediate family and prepare my extended family and friends for three months of self-quarantine. They all get survival presents for gift giving. I have lobbied heavily at work for people to be realistic about their behaviors. For example I throw away Doctors' coffee cups when they make rounds. I am a hall monitor for washing hands etc.

Through the years I have found that isolation and security are closely related. People love to defy the system and when the heat is on, the frequent flyers will be the first to surface. Like rats from a sinking ship, your radar should go up at that point. Many of the ill may not even make it to the hospital. All the historical recounts of the 1918 Flu state that people died while carrying on their daily activities. They got up in the morning, coughed at noon and died before supper.

Sadly, the hospital should begin by closing the doors. You are right no one wants to talk about it. But if the hospital is to survive, that is it's only move. The staff that is left will have to organize under safe conditions, or there will be nothing. The doctor that was left to care for the ones who had little chance for survival in Hurricane Katrina's wake was slandered w/ all sorts of allegations and years of court room time for rendering care. This an excellent example of what to expect.

The public wants to believe that the nurse is there and ever self sacrificing to make sure that an individual needs are taken care of. We have to take care of ourselves first. The Airlines on every flight state that a person has to first breath from the oxygen mask before they can render aid to others. So it is for the nurse, doctors and hospital.

Good Luck.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Doesn't sound like a winning plan to me. Sort of like a General who threatens to shoot all the soldiers who leave their post. If your position is over run then you lose all of your soldiers. Those that leave will not come back. For a CEO to mandate such a plan they would have to be confident that if everyone held to there positions then the ER could batter such a storm. I am not at all confident. My efforts will be to convince my collegues that there needs to be a safe place to fall back to.

You are correct about it not being a winning plan. I forgot to mention that this hospital is on an island surrounded by skyscrapers, and in the middle of a very populated city. It's a hugh hospital. I do not know if I would feel comfortable working there. Just to get to it, one must travel thru the city in heavy traffic. I am afraid that a pandemic flu disaster would make this a very unsafe place to be.

I have zero confidence in their plan.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/EID/index.htm International conference on Emerging Infectious diseases :tiphat: gsgs
Assessing County Health Department Employees? Willingness to Respond to an Influenza Pandemic

Background: During an influenza pandemic, local health department employees are expected to play a significant role in carrying out response and control protocols. However, little is known about how informed employees are about pandemic response or how willing they are to respond. The Florida Department of Health, in an effort led by the state health office and its 67 county health departments, has been actively planning the response efforts to be undertaken in the event of a pandemic. Here, we determine how knowledgeable local health department employees are about pandemic influenza, how likely they are to respond, and which factors are significantly associated with a willingness to respond to a pandemic.
Methods: We conducted an anonymous, online survey of 4,746 Florida county health department employees randomly selected using a stratified random cluster sample. We gathered information about demographics, knowledge of pandemic response, and the likelihood of reporting to a pandemic given 4 different scenarios that specified the stage of the pandemic (early vs. peak) and the type of duties required (lower risk - no face-to-face contact vs. higher risk - face-to-face contact). Responses were weighted based upon the sampling fraction and the response rates. Multivariate logistic regression was used in the main analysis.
Results: Of the 2,414 (51%) unique responses received, willingness to respond to a pandemic varied by the stage of the pandemic and the type of job duties. 92% were very or somewhat likely to respond early in the pandemic and perform lower risk jobs, 66% early in the pandemic with higher risk jobs, 83% at the peak of the pandemic with lower risk jobs, and 56% at the peak with higher risk jobs. Those who have read either the state or county pandemic flu plan and nurses were significantly more likely to report a willingness to respond. Having attended a pan flu training was not significantly associated with willingness to respond to any scenario.
Conclusions: These results indicate that the majority of Florida county health department employees surveyed are willing to respond to an influenza pandemic, but that their willingness declines during the peak of the pandemic and when face-to-face contact is required. These results highlight underlying issues that must be addressed prior to a pandemic event.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

The study you reference asks the question whether county health department employees will come to work. There is a little bit of a problem with this whole question. The health Department Employees are all government employees, they all have medical insurance and workmans comp. They generally staff pre-natal clinics, VD clinics etc. I am sure they do a fine job, a thankless job, they are treating some of the most disenfranchised in our society. That being said they aren't even part of the front lines. These clinics generally are open 9-5 Monday to Saturday. They close on holidays. These people are granted global tort immunity during pandemic no one else is. They are also not required by law to treat all patients that arrive at there facility. In actuality they will be the command and control and will not be the soldiers. In my part of the state we are in a district of 16 counties. In those 16 counties there is one public health MD and 5 public health nurses. I can't imagine how they would or could attempt to impose any law or order upon the Doctors and Nurses that staff the ERs.
On a more personal level during the Katrina evacuation our community set up a Red Cross relief clinic. The public health came in on day 4 and succeeded in alienating all of the staff. I can not begin to describe how much their actions infuriated the actual volunteers, staff, patients and their families. (you don't want to tick off doctor's wifes they don't take it well!)
No one from Public Health has since set foot in our hospital. I go to their planning meetings but not a whole lot of the keystone members of the medical community will have anything to do with them. I am fairly certain that this type of anamosity is not present in most areas but I still can't see any ER staff taking orders from people who have not earned their respect. Getting back to an earlier post I doubt that the CEO will lead by force and intimidation either. Someone will rise to a leadership role but it will be someone with personal charisma and who commands respect. This respect will be earned not by putting the staff in harms way but by considering staff well-being first
 
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Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

In my part of the state we are in a district of 16 counties. In those 16 counties there is one public health MD and 5 public health nurses. I can't imagine how they would or could attempt to impose any law or order upon the Doctors and Nurses that staff the ERs....
but I still can't see any ER staff taking orders from people who have not earned their respect.
As the population ages in the U.S., there will soon be mass retirements of experienced and knowledgeable Public Health Workers. See this link about the coming problem in Utah:
http://www.flutrackers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=60027
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Gullwing,
It appears from your post there is a lot of animosity which would have to be dealt with during a pandemic.

Even though the public heath dept is not on the frontlines, we will still continue to need pre-natal, venereal disease clinics operating.
Only 58% of those workers will come to work at high risk jobs during peak pandemic. That figure may well go down once they see what a real AI pandemic looks like.

The fact that only half the questionnaires were returned left me curious. I wonder if that is a typical amount.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Folks, look at the SARS episode in China, and Canada.
Somebody remained into the story to do the job.

The ones who will be at duty where the contagion happens, will be the ones who will cary it on, in isolation. The rest of the staff have a chance to change the job, escape, or got a forced duty.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

RE: Gullwing

I would like to know if anyone in any medical community has a fall back position where the staff can rally and rebuild?


It seems as though you have a closer experience to a disaster than most. As someone said before "You never know who will be the one to rise to the occasion." My point is to avoid as little destruction to the existing structure and staff by surviving the initial impact of the masses. I'd put the public health crew at the top of the list to work the masses and triage outside the closed door.
 
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Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

Sunshine what I envision as the only hope for success is for those health care providers who are of the belief that there is futility in attempting to "treat the masses" to fall back away from any "hot zone". You will need a facility that is clandestined and you will treat only those persons with a chance for survival. How do you determine the later? It would be essentially only those who have food water and PPE. The way I figure it only the ones that build the ark will know where it is and will be invited on board. It sounds pretty harsh but all have been invited on board. If you choose not to "sign up" until its too late then you are free to persue your previous plan (or lack there of). I think there are enough medical personell in my clique that will fall back quickly and with equiptment to make this work. Most are unwilling to commit openly for fear of reprisals. Thes are interesting times we live in.
 
Re: Will Nurses Work During a Pandemic?

So many nurses already feel that they are undervalued and exploited. Add to that the memory of the fight to get hospitals to move to safer injectables. Cost was more important than safety for far too long. We may end up reaping what we have sown - nurses and other health care workers who refuse to be taken advantage of any more.

Peggy, You have no idea how glad I am to see your post. I want to discuss with some colleagues a unique plan to get safer injectables in use and not just on a back shelf of a hidden room where nurses can't even find them and become familiar with them on their own. Please contact me at safenurse at live dot com.

There are too many innocent victims: the family members of exposed nurses and the generations of nurses still being taught unsafe practices.

Be safe
 
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