Ukraine War discussion - Threat to Public Health

[GardenSpider]

Horrible. Azov militants are Neo-nazis and complete intertwined with military and government. They are a brutal force with a history of bloodshed. God help us if they come to power.

 

[GardenSpider]

Horrible. Azov militants are Neo-nazis andl intertwined with Ukrainian military and government. They are a brutal force with a long history of bloodshed.
God help us if they should rise to power, which is their hope.

 

[alert]

This is a rather odd argument and one initially put out by Russian propaganda and disinformation campaigns. There is a clear limit as to the extent of neo-Nazi influence in Ukraine, given that their president is Jewish. Even if Russia felt that there was a neo-Nazi threat within Ukraine, that doesn't justify an invasion of the country to eliminate it. There are much more clear and larger neo-Nazi presences in the US, France, UK, etc. Does Russia intend to invade those as well?

 

[GardenSpider]

The present and very dangerous Ukrainian crisis seems to be fueled by many powerful interests, several of them not widely reported.
Here are a few additional links with information that may help us all achieve a better understanding of the origins of the conflict, war, and history in Ukraine and where it may lead:

SHARON TENNISON- UKRAINE, RUSSIA, NATO, THE U.S. AND THE INTERCONNECTIONS BETWEEN THEM
A discussion
https://youtu.be/faiR-RyLwn8

* Russian Defense Ministry: Documents/Evidence Proves US Developed Bio-Weapons in Ukraine
https://www.veteranstoday.com/2022/...es-us-developed-bio-weapons-in-ukraine-covid/
The agency published the original materials from Ukrainian biological laboratories

According to the General, information was received from employees of Ukrainian biological laboratories about the urgent destruction of especially dangerous pathogens on February 24:

…plague, anthrax, tularemia, cholera and other deadly diseases.

more....

* Ukraine’s Nukes and Weapons of Mass Destruction
https://www.veteranstoday.com/2022/03/06/ukraines-dirty-nukes-and-weapons-of-mass-destruction/

By Nauman Sadiq, VT Islamabad

Russian media alleged today that Ukraine was close to building a plutonium-based “dirty bomb” nuclear weapon. The TASS, RIA and Interfax news agencies quoted “a representative of a competent body” in Russia as saying Ukraine was developing nuclear weapons at the destroyed Chernobyl nuclear power plant recently seized by Russian forces.

Shortly before the military intervention in Ukraine, Russian President Putin also noted in an address to the nation that Ukraine was using Soviet know-how to create its own nuclear weapons, and that this was tantamount to preparation for an attack on Russia.

more...


* You’re Being Lied to About Ukraine & Russia | The Truth—with Pedro Gonzalez
https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR...Nzg4MWE4?ep=14

With staggering amounts of propaganda emanating from the conflict in Ukraine, and with the Western Media’s agenda-driven, full-throated embrace of it all, Charlie is joined by Pedro Gonzalez, Associate Editor of Chronicles Magazine, to help make sense of it all. Throughout the conversation, Pedro gives some of the most comprehensive, detailed breakdowns of what is being done by Ukrainian President Zelenskyy, how the West is responding, the shocking and largely untold history of the region, and finally—where all the capitulation and chaos will eventually lead civilization as we know it.

more...

* Ukrainian President Zelenskyy... Yes, Really
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2022/03/...yy-yes-really/

Before he ran for the presidency, Volodymyr Zelenskyy was a comedian. Here’s a video from 8 years ago that was wiped from YouTube but which was resurrected on BitChute on the Plazma channel.

more....

 

[alert]

I do appreciate your attempt to show all media views of this conflict, particularly those not widely shared in the West.

But a lot of what you have posted in the above several posts is clearly false information put out by the Russian government to serve as disinformation to back its unlawful invasion of its neighbor.

A quick example...you cite Russian claims that Ukraine was trying to use plutonium to build a dirty bomb. Why would they do that? There are much more widely available radioactive isotopes that one could use than something as rare and guarded as plutonium. But of course, if plutonium is a problem in Ukraine, then the nuclear power plants become military targets....

 

[sharon sanders]

As I mentioned a few times on the COVID-19 discussion threads, we are not a political site. Thanks for some background on some of the problems in Ukraine. Every country - sadly - has a lunatic fringe.

Ukraine had about 42 million people with approximately 1.5 million recently evaculated. Please focus on the huge humanitarian problem that is developing. As I said on the COVID-19 threads we are not going to solve any of the political problems. In this case an International Criminal Court has been convened that will investigate Ukraine issues back to 2013.

The health problems (mental and physical) that are being created by the Russian invasion will be far reaching. Not only are the Ukrainians affected but also the Russian citizens, Poland, Moldova, the Baltic states...more...

This site lost participants when I would not let people spend energy on bashing Trump, Fauci, HHS, CDC, W.H.O., Biden, etc. in the pandemic but we have a long standing policy against being political. I stated a few times that it will be up to future tribunals to determine what occurred and who is to blame. Politics are devisive for the site - and then who are we helping?

People count on us to be the one place where objectivity is a priority.

-----------------------------

I also want to add that governments - especially the "Super Powers" can not use the lunatic fringe group excuse to invade a neighbor. An example of this would be if the US used the excuse of the numerous deadly Mexican cartels on our border region to militarily invade Mexico. The US could use the excuse that the Mexican government is not enforcing their own laws and is putting US lives on the line every single day with the drug smuggling and corresponding violence. In fact, Mexico is one of the most violent places in the world now due to the cartel violence. Of the top 10 most violent cities in the world, 7 Mexican cities are listed - with 2 on the US border. link

 

[Okieman]

"Threat to Public Health" is the title of this thread. Politics is not supposed to be part of it. One nation invaded another and is now killing it's citizens in addition to it's soldiers. One has boots on the ground on another nations land and is killing people. Most definitely a threat to their public health. The same nation that invaded is also making threats it will utilize it's nuclear arsenal against other nations if they do not stay out. Most definitely a threat to other nation's public health.

Keep the discussion on threats to public health and not the politics on either side. If this cannot be done then Sharon please remove me from this website. I do not want to have anything to do with it.

(No, I am not interested in any sort of debate on this. I've said what I have been wanting to say for several days now.)

 

[sharon sanders]

Okieman - I agree. I am now moving to a firm warning.

I moved the posts made since I last asked for no more political comments earlier today on post #29 at 8:44 am.

We are sticking to our long term policies. They are successful and proven.

This thread is about public health.

 

[sharon sanders]

UNHCR & UNICEF: Unaccompanied and separated children fleeing escalating conflict in Ukraine must be protected - March 7, 2022

 

[sharon sanders]

I am not banning Russia sources on this site for the reason that these official media give a great insight into the mindset of the leader(s). You do not read the media releases for face value. You read them to get an idea of what is really going on. Some of the media posts are complete fiction, some contain some pertinent information. I am selective.

This process has been invaluable in finding out what China is doing. Always look behind the words. For instance, my favorite China articles are the denials.

 

[Emily]

There are labs in Ukraine that could become a public health threat if they fall into the wrong hands if the chaos continues in the country.

https://www.state.gov/wp-content/upl...ne-Weapons.pdf

https://www.nap.edu/download/13315
National Research Council 2012. Biosecurity Challenges of the Global Expansion
of High-Containment Biological Laboratories: Summary of a Workshop.
Washington, DC: The National Academies Press. https://doi.org/10.17226/13315.

"A second laboratory of the SI “Ukrainian I. I. Mechnikov Anti-Plague Research Institute” of the Ministry of Health of Ukraine also
has a permit to work with microorganisms of the first pathogenic group, but it is not updated to the BSL-3
level. This laboratory works only with the especially dangerous infections of bacterial etiology. The third
laboratory upgraded to the BSL-3 level belongs to the Central Sanitary Epidemiological Station of the
Ministry of Health of Ukraine. This laboratory was updated within the State program and the above mentioned
cooperative agreement between Ukraine and the United States. It has a permit to work with
microorganisms of the second pathogenic group and is intended for work with especially dangerous
infections.

 

[sharon sanders]

Apparently Russia is trying to evaculate Ukranians to Russia?


Russian source.


16:59 08.03.2022


Kyiv does not allow attempts to evacuate residents to Russia, said the Ministry of Defense
Colonel General Mizintsev: Kyiv does not allow attempts to evacuate residents to Russia

MOSCOW, March 8 - RIA Novosti. Representatives of the Kiev authorities and mayors of cities do not allow attempts to evacuate citizens to the Russian Federation, information about the humanitarian corridors created by Russia is not brought to the attention of civilians, said the head of the National Defense Control Center of the Russian Federation, Colonel-General Mikhail Mizintsev.

more..

zhttps://ria.ru/20220308/kiev-1777164155.html

 

[Shiloh]

Source: https://news.yahoo.com/attacks-ukrainian-hospitals-ambulances-increasing-102034157-131753454.html

WHO: Attacks on Ukrainian hospitals, ambulances increasing rapidly
Tue, March 8, 2022, 8:17 AM·1 min read

(Reuters) - Attacks on hospitals, ambulances and other health care facilities in Ukraine have increased rapidly in recent days and the country is running short of vital medical supplies, the World Health Organization (WHO) said on Tuesday.

The U.N. agency confirmed on Monday that at least nine people had died in 16 attacks on health care facilities since the start of a Russian invasion of Ukraine on Feb. 24. It did not say who was responsible.

The WHO's senior emergency officer for Europe, Catherine Smallwood, told a news briefing that the tally included incidents where ambulances had been commandeered for purposes other than emergency healthcare...

 

[Pathfinder]

Statement – WHO: Health care provision for civilians within and refugees beyond Ukraine our priority

16Statement by Dr Hans Henri P. Kluge, WHO Regional Director for Europe


Copenhagen, 8 March 2022

Good morning, good afternoon,

It is now 13 days since the military offensive began in Ukraine, and today within the country we see a health system under severe pressure, and beyond its borders the fastest growing refugee crisis in Europe for more than 75 years.

In these difficult days WHO’s priorities are threefold:

Firstly, we are working to get the health supplies that are needed into Ukraine, and ensure a sustainable system of “safe passage” for the delivery of humanitarian health supplies to where they are needed within the country. I have been working closely with Amin Awad, Assistant Secretary-General and UN Crisis Coordinator for Ukraine to establish such a route. Life-saving essential medicines, such as oxygen and insulin, personal protective equipment, surgical supplies, anaesthetics and safe blood products, are in short supply. So far, 2 shipments totalling 76 tonnes (36 + 40 tonnes) of trauma and emergency health supplies, as well as freezers, refrigerators, ice packs and cool boxes are in transit in Ukraine. We have further shipments of 500 oxygen concentrators and more supplies are on their way.

A second priority is to ensure that neighbouring countries have the infrastructure and expertise in place to meet the urgent health needs of those arriving. According to UNHCR, more than 1.7 million people, the vast majority women and children, have left Ukraine since 24 February. All those seeking refuge, including internationals who had been residing in Ukraine, must be granted movement across Europe.

We have deployed expert WHO teams to Hungary, Poland, the Republic of Moldova and Romania – here working with UNHCR and coordinating closely with the relevant governments, local authorities and partners to assess the needs of incoming refugees upon entry at the border, build health system capacity to accommodate large numbers of refugees and ensure access to services.

I myself oversaw the arrival of the first shipment of WHO supplies, and had the opportunity to meet a few of the people who had recently arrived from Ukraine, when I visited the border area of Rzeszow in Poland last Thursday. I saw more than exhaustion and relief. Looking into people’s eyes – there is uncertainty and anguish among children and women. Their health needs encompass services for vaccine preventable diseases; maternal, newborn and child health; noncommunicable diseases, HIV and TB, and not least, mental health and psychosocial support. Let me add that the welcome they have received from local people and health-care staff has been phenomenal.

Next week, we will be holding a long-planned regional meeting on refugee and migrant health. This will bring together health ministers, and representatives of refugee and migrant groups, partner organizations and other WHO regions, to take account of current needs in a longer-term context. Through political commitment and partnership, we seek to establish a new vision for the health of refugees and migrants, across the European Region and further afield.

Our third focus at this moment is to provide support on immediate health requirements within Ukraine through a fully functioning WHO operations centre in western Ukraine. We are responding to the urgent need for trauma and injury support with rapid refresher training, supplies, and staffing through the mobilization of medical teams.

Continuity of care for those with long-term health needs is a major challenge because broken supply lines are affecting the treatment of conditions such as diabetes and hypertension, as well as cancer.

According to UNFPA, an estimated 80 000 women will give birth in the next 3 months without access to critical maternal care.

Re-establishing and maintaining vaccination programmes and continuing treatment for people living with TB and HIV, are priorities, as is the provision of mental health services.

We are working to support these essential medical needs through fixed facilities and field hospitals or mobile health services, and by making key diagnostics, medicines and medical supplies available.

It should not need saying that health workers, hospitals and other medical facilities must never be a target at any time, including during crises and conflicts. To date, we have 16 confirmed reports of attacks on health in Ukraine, and more are being verified. WHO strongly condemns these attacks on health-care services.

Today is International Women’s Day, a moment when we should be celebrating the myriad ways in which women improve the world we all live in – including as green entrepreneurs, health pioneers, community champions and political role models. But as events unfold in eastern Europe, I must recognize their leadership and the need for their voice in this crisis.

Women are the key responders in this humanitarian emergency.

Before 24 February, 71% of households in the conflict areas in Ukraine were already headed by women, and now these numbers are increasing every day. They make up 83% of the country’s health workforce. Women are the breadwinners whilst caring for children and the frail. They are organizing and distributing assistance and aid. And they are risking their lives to deliver life-saving health services.

In conflict situations, and when displaced, women face specific risks and have particular health needs. Past conflicts have shown us that adolescent girls, women with disabilities and elderly women are in the most vulnerable situation. They face an increased risk of suffering attacks by people outside the home and by armed groups, as well as intimate partner violence and sexual abuse and exploitation.

The health needs of women and girls, including emergency obstetric care, maternal health, reproductive health, and response to sexual and gender-based violence must be prioritized.

Women are key players in reducing conflict and advancing stability as their participation increases the chances of ensuring lasting conflict resolution and peace, yet they almost always remain absent from negotiations.

On this International Women’s Day, I express my deep appreciation for their invaluable contribution to health and well-being, today and every day. And I will work to ensure that the specific health needs of women and girls are embedded in the response to this humanitarian crisis.

Let me now provide a brief update on the COVID-19 situation in Ukraine and across the European Region.

Remarkably, Ukraine has maintained its COVID-19 surveillance and response system. I commend my Ukrainian colleagues in this regard and encourage them to continue. 731 COVID-19 deaths were reported to WHO from Ukraine last week, and sadly this number will increase as oxygen shortages continue. Older people will be disproportionately affected as their access to health care is disrupted, and because only a third of the over-60s are fully protected with a complete vaccine series.

Across the WHO European Region, cases of COVID-19 are declining week on week, and the number of deaths has also fallen every week since 10 February. While this is good news, I would call on countries to balance optimism with maintaining vaccination and strong vigilance, and ensure that any lifting of public health and social measures, including testing, can be reintroduced quickly if and when required.

Finally, it is my deepest sorrow to see my region emerging from 2 terrible pandemic years being now confronted with the devastating impact of military hostilities on dozens of millions of its people in Ukraine and beyond. Through personal experience in other conflicts, I firmly believe that health and humanitarian principles remain key drivers of peace and I am using all diplomatic resources that are at my disposal as elected WHO leader to reduce the impact of this human catastrophe.

Thank you

https://www.euro.who.int/en/media-c...thin-and-refugees-beyond-ukraine-our-priority

 

[JJackson]

This is a mistake on the part of the Kyiv. Moving civilians West is only going to put them in the path of more fighting. If they can be moved into the area behind the Russian front lines they should be safely out of the fighting. Civilians have been moved out of Sumy to Poltava but they will have to moved again as Poltava is in the path of the Russian advance and has problems of its own.

 

[Emily]

It's difficult to separate politics from a man-made disaster that is clearly due to geopolitics. Killing, mutilating, starvation, displacement and destruction will not solve this problem. Politics with peace as the goal will.

 

[sharon sanders]

I removed two posts off this thread.

I do not want to see any Putin claims on this site. Of course, he is going to blame all other parties for various things. There is no free press is Russia so it is impossible to verify his accusations. And Ukraine is a War Zone. The press who are there are risking their lives - literally. They are not in all areas. Almost nothing can be independently verified.

For instance, I have not posted the claims by Zelensky that Ukraine has killed 11k Russian soldiers. To me that claim is not credible even if it is carried by CNN, for example. No one knows how many dead there are. Certainly there are hundreds - including innocent civilians. But can anyone say there have been organized sweeps of bombed buildings in all areas? No.

Final warning.

 

[Emily]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...r-slams-us-military-aid-to-ukraine/ar-AAUMUkK
‘Unpredictable and Likely Disastrous’: Ilhan Omar Slams US Military Aid to Ukraine
Jackson Richman - 14h ago
Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-MN) slammed U.S. military assistance to Ukraine on Tuesday as “unpredictable and likely disastrous” amid the Russian military invasion.

“The consequences of flooding Ukraine with billion dollars in [U.S.] weapons, likely not limited to just military-specific equipment but also including small arms + ammo, are unpredictable & likely disastrous,” she tweeted. “[Especially] when they are given to paramilitary groups w/out accountability.”...

 

[JJackson]

What constitutes a "Putin claim"? Are you intending to censure the leader in one side of this conflict and not statements made by Zelensky, Biden, Johnson etc. many of which have been far from grounded in any semblance of reality?
There is a massive propaganda war going on, from both sides, in an attempt to win 'hearts & minds' and I do not trust any of them. I hope this site is not about to take sides. For the record I do not favour one over the other, a plague on both their houses.

 

[Okieman]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Macgregor

See the "Views" portion of the Wikipedia entry.