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Discussion thread VII - COVID-19: Endemic Stage

There were a lot of people asking for prayers for COVID illnesses on a prayer forum today, more than I noticed during Delta, though the Delta cases were mostly very severe. A woman described just getting over a case and found depression moved in on her at that point. Her husband was just getting ill and already showing mood changes. That sounded unusual. Also there was a 1 month old with COVID. It sounded like he was OK, but would have to be watched for a few weeks.

And there was a younger man sick at home for over a week afraid he would be fired.
 
Sinovac - none of the patients getting their first dose were affected by the spilled vaccine - just nurses who had been already vaccinated with the same vaccine. - E



Kevin McKernan @Kevin_McKernan

This is fine

Quote Tweet

IHC9w5bt_mini.jpg

Dr John B.
@DrJohnB2
· Jan 28

Eye and skin irritation after exposure to evaporated #CovidVaccine: https://karger.com/Article/FullText/520500

"... the vaccine was dropped accidentally onto the floor and broken by an administering nurse." "We recommend caution during vaccine handling and fastidious clean-up of any spills."





8:48 AM · Jan 28, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
 
if something like COVID or especially omicron had happened some centuries ago,
would they have decribed it as influenza ?
Remembering all the old books that we had studied here in 2006-2008
and their desciptions of the history of influenza.

It looks somehow unlikely that Corona epidemics had never been observed before.


Translation Google


Did a coronavirus pandemic take place 130 years ago?

The "Russian" flu that claimed a million lives at the end of the 19th century has long been attributed to the influenza virus. But there are signs that a coronavirus is the cause, experts say.

Mathieu Gobeil
March 7, 2021

“I don't think I've ever felt so weak, not even after having malaria in Genoa,” wrote English feminist and social reformer Josephine Butler in a January 1892 letter to her son. She attributes her symptoms of inflamed lungs and her conjunctivitis to the Russian flu which she allegedly contracted the previous Christmas.

Three months later, she still hasn't recovered. I am so weak that if I write or read for half an hour, I feel very tired as if I was going to faint, and I have to lie down , she confides to an acquaintance.

The disease causes thousands of his compatriots with fever, cough, pain and respiratory problems. But also neurological and fatigue symptoms that are reminiscent of those of COVID-19, researchers now believe.

British historian Mark Honigsbaum identified symptoms which are described in the 1890s about this pandemic: neuralgia, neuritis, post-influenza numbness , inertia , psychosis, anxiety and paranoia, among others. Some doctors of the time also believe that they are not dealing with the flu.

Like a straw fire

This pandemic originated in the steppes of the Russian Empire, during the year 1889, possibly in Uzbekistan. The virus spread very quickly along the railways, in full expansion at the time in Russia and Europe.

The city of Saint-Petersburg was seriously affected in the fall of 1889. Then the epidemic quickly moved towards Sweden, and then Western Europe , relates the professor of demography at the University of Montreal Alain Gagnon who studies historical epidemics and pandemics.

“ It is spreading like wildfire. »

— A quote from Alain Gagnon, professor of demography at the University of Montreal

In Paris, deaths reached peaks of more than 400 dead on certain days in the winter of 1889-90. A similar scenario is unfolding in London and other European capitals. Several crowned heads and political leaders fell ill. Queen Victoria's grandson will die of it.

In addition to the railway, the development of fast connections by boat contributes to the rapid spread of the virus, relates Professor Gagnon. The first cases in North America were already recorded at the end of December 1889. In Canada, the port of Halifax was the first affected. In Montreal, Quebec City, Toronto and several other cities, cases increase in January and there is an increase in mortality. In subsequent years, the disease returns in waves, sometimes more deadly than the first.

It was the first epidemic that was, let's say, tracked. Public health agencies were in their infancy in the late 1800s , recalls the demographer.

We therefore have government data as well as reports from caregivers and newspaper articles.

"It was also a time when there was a great debate as to whether these epidemics were caused by "miasmas" (emanations from sewers, for example) and particular atmospheric conditions, or by transmissible infectious agents. between people" , microbiology being then in its infancy, explains Alain Gagnon.

There were therefore no measures taken such as physical distancing or the wearing of a mask, which would be introduced in 1918-19 during the Spanish flu, thanks to a better knowledge of the transmission of viruses. This influenza pandemic at the end of the First World War was nevertheless much more deadly, with its 50 to 100 million victims .

From animal to human

However, work published in 2005 by a Belgian team perhaps shed new light on the events of 1889-90. By sequencing the genome of the OC43 coronavirus – one of four benign coronaviruses that circulate widely today and cause colds – researchers have managed to estimate that it passed from cattle to humans around 1890.

Last year, a Danish team reported results similar to those of the Belgian team, also dating the emergence of OC43 from the bovine coronavirus BCoV to around 1890, work that has yet to be published in a scientific journal.

Taking this information into account, and the fact that the 1889-90 disease was more severe in men than in women and appeared to affect the nervous system, much like COVID-19, scientists have suggested that this pandemic could be caused by the OC43 coronavirus.

"We know that at the time there was a massive slaughter of cattle herds because of a bacterial disease (not attributable to a coronavirus). This could have increased contact between the workers and the livestock and they could have contracted the coronavirus which was possibly circulating in the animal" , explains Burtram Fielding, professor of molecular biology at the University of the Western Cape, in South Africa, and coronavirus expert.

"Why are so many neurological symptoms reported at the time? It is known that for the three deadly coronaviruses, those of SARS in 2003, MERS in 2012 and that of COVID-19, there is a greater incidence of neurological manifestations. And coronaviruses are known to cause neurological symptoms in animals" , Professor Fielding explains.

Despite everything, the attribution of the 1889-90 pandemic to a coronavirus remains a hypothesis.

"The genetic arguments supporting the hypothesis of a coronavirus are quite convincing" , judge Alain Gagnon. But as for the descriptions of symptoms from the time, they do not make it possible to distinguish a flu from an illness similar to COVID-19, he notes.

First, in the late 19th century, it was common to associate physical symptoms with mental problems, such as nervous states and anxiety, which had to do with "nerves" , as it was understood in the era.

In addition, during the Spanish flu, underlines the demographer, certain neurological symptoms were also reported. or cardiovascular and patients dragged out sequelae for months, as in the case of COVID-19.

Also, children were not spared by the pandemic of 1889-90, recalls Alain Gagnon, just like during the Spanish flu and other influenza pandemics.

Finally, serological studies on immunity suggest that people born before 1889 were partly protected from the 1968 pandemic (the Hong Kong flu), which points to exposure to a similar strain of influenza in both cases.

"We can still raise the hypothesis that the coronavirus and the flu virus could have appeared at the same time or circulated in the population towards the end of the 1890s" , advances Alain Gagnon.

It is very difficult to prove or disprove the coronavirus hypothesis. But at the same time, it's very difficult to prove or disprove the flu hypothesis , admits Burtram Fielding.

"The only way to find out would be to isolate the virus and sequence it, as was done for the Spanish flu virus" , adds Mr. Gagnon.

Indeed, researchers in the late 1990s recovered Spanish flu virus RNA fragments in Alaska from a body preserved in permafrost. They also harvested fragments from tissue taken from American flu victims in 1918-19 and then stored. This made it possible, in the 2000s , reconstruct the genetic code of this AH1N1 virus.

But as for the Russian flu, we have to go back 28 years before the Spanish flu. And there were far fewer deaths. So, you would really have to be lucky [to find preserved remains that would allow you to do the same], but that would be the hammer argument , says Professor Gagnon.

Review the toll of mild coronaviruses

With the outbreaks of SARS, MERS and COVID-19 in recent years, scientists are revisiting the coronavirus family. According to Burtram Fielding, it is worth looking into the supposedly mild coronaviruses that cause the common cold, both to understand historical episodes, but also to better envisage the future in the pandemic we are living through.

"Viruses like OC43 today may be causing far more deaths around the world than we realize. It is known that such viruses can be problematic in some children, for example those who are immunosuppressed. It's just that we haven't collected data on their wider impact" , says the South African researcher. An American group is working precisely to measure the extent of the mortality of these benign coronaviruses, he mentions.

For example, in 2003, when an outbreak occurred in a residence for the elderly in British Columbia, everything suggested that SARS-CoV was the culprit. And for good reason: this deadly coronavirus at the time caused a health crisis in Canada and in several countries. Eight residents die of the 95 infected. But tests later show that this outbreak was due to OC43, this supposedly benign coronavirus.

"The death rate was approaching 10%" , reports Mr. Fielding. It can therefore turn out, in certain circumstances, to be more deadly than one might think, he continues.
...

https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle...histoire-covid
 
Thinking about this more...doing a blockade is a form of sanctioning in response to another form of sanctioning. (No vax, no job, etc). I wouldn't join a border protest unless the border remained open. I've loathed sanctions since the US caused the deaths of over 500,000 children in Iraq in the 1990's.
 
https://www.freightwaves.com/news/florida-trucker-in-canada-convoy-were-here-to-join-a-movement
Florida trucker in Canada convoy: ‘We’re here to join a movement’
As protest rolls through Toronto, vaccinated US-Canadian driver explains his support

Nate Tabak Follow on Twitter Friday, January 28, 2022
VAUGHAN, Ontario — Florida-based owner-operator DeAndre Mahadeo, like other truckers who rolled past throngs of supporters just outside Toronto, got a rousing send-off on Thursday as he prepared to head to the capital, Ottawa, in a protest against COVID-19 vaccine mandates at the border.

Hundreds of people of all ages called them heroes and even freedom fighters as 15 to 20 trucks and a few hundred passenger vehicles paraded through a mall parking lot in Vaughan. Some handed over boxes of cookies, brownies and other snacks.

“We’re here to join a movement,” said Mahadeo, 30, a dual U.S.-Canadian citizen who regularly moves freight in both countries. “We need to end these restrictions once and for all.”...
 
Mark Woolhouse, an infectious-disease epidemiologist at the University of Edinburgh, UK, who also advises the government.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-00210-7
  • NEWS
  • 31 January 2022
Will Omicron end the pandemic? Here’s what experts say

...
For Woolhouse, COVID-19 will truly become endemic only when most adults are protected against severe infection because they have been exposed multiple times to the virus as children, and so have developed natural immunity. That will take decades, and it means many older people today (who were not exposed as children) will remain vulnerable and might need continued vaccinations.

That strategy has its flaws. Some of those exposed as children will develop long COVID. And it relies on children continuing to show much lower rates of severe illness as variants evolve.

There are no guarantees that the next variant will be milder, but Tang says that seems to be the pattern so far. “This virus is getting milder and milder with each iteration,” he says.
 
you need no virus from 1889 - just find a related virus in bats. (or whatever)
More and more feces and such are being examined with massive data analysis.
 
gs - you will need the virus from 1889 as the virus in question, for OC43 was Bovine Corona virus from sequence homology, but that does not answer the question 'was the 1889 pandemic due to a flu or CoV?' for that we need a preserved RNA sequence from one of its victims.
 
I think Woodhouse is on the right track but would argue the virus is already endemic. The high morbidity will decline once everyone has been challenged by the virus, or vaccine, and will be maintained throughout life by subsequent re-challenges. The problem comes for the very young, who have yet to have had their initial childhood vaccination, and the very old whose frailty makes even moderate illness life threatening. For the rest of us it will be an ILI we have to put up with.
Tang is way off track. In order of virulence the VOC probably run Gamma, Beta, Delta, Alpha and Omicron with the ancestral strain about the same as Alpha. It is very hard to compare the strains as they each infected very different host populations so only their severity in hosts that have never been infected or vaccinated can be gauged. Even if you have not been vaccinated and never been ill that does not mean you have not been challenged and fought of the infection before it could get established. This will be enough to give you a little immune memory and a milder subsequent course of illness, a few challenges like this will leave you well protected.
To the best of my knowledge I have only had flu once, in the 1968 pandemic, and very rarely get a cold. I doubt this is due to not being challenged by the viruses but by being lucky enough to have a robust immune system that gets regularly primed.
 
THIS IS NOT MEDICAL ADVICE. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT ANY MEDICAL SITUATION, CONTACT YOUR MEDICAL PRACTITIONER.


Someone has asked me if I plan on taking more COVID-19 vaccines/boosters given some of the vaccine risks that have become more quantified. I am fully vaccinated plus booster with no side effects that I know of.

I am in a "wait and see" mode. I have previously disclosed that I am very high risk. I assumed that the vaccines would carry some risk but it was my assessment that at least in the short term the risk of a COVID-19 infection was worse.

I do not routinely take an annual flu shot. I am an occasional user. Some years yes...some years not. This year I have not taken a seasonal flu shot, for instance. My plan is the same for the COVID-19 vaccines. I will consider more but I do not plan to be a "frequent flyer".

I have hope that COVID-19 will become very manageable with new drugs. Maybe in combination with some natural therapies, over-the-counter and re-purposed drugs?

I think everyone should keep their options open and continue to monitor the situation.

I am neither pro-vaccine or anti-vaccine. I am open.

I am VERY PRO-N95 MASK and I have repeatedly said this since early 2020. I feel this mask is a great protection for me.

I have chosen to live a limited life for now. I do not go to indoor restaurants or anywhere crowded. I am high risk so I am employing several preventative layers to take care of me. With the current downtrend in cases in Florida I might chose to venture out more - but always with an N95 mask that is in good condition.

Thank you to everyone for participating! Always use at least two sources for your information. And use your common sense.

Take care of you!
 
A few more comments in response to inquiries. I am committed to a public discussion.

I know N95 masks are not "the answer". They only filter 95% instead of 100%. Used alone - they are not a guarantee of anything. I add social distancing to my lifestyle so in that context N95 masks work very well for me.

As readers know I have been warning against continuing mandates. IMHO the populations can not tolerate much more. The governments job is to protect the citizens - not push them over the emotional/financial edge. Particularly worrisome are the vaccine mandates. I believe it is against human rights to force anyone to take any medicine.

Governments should, instead, in this emerging endemic stage help give us the tools to protect ourselves. I listed a few items in post 18 above.

If a private company wants to make vaccines mandatory - that is their right. The employees can either comply or leave and sue. But governments do not have the right to do this. imho.

Yes, I have received some "blow back" for allowing non-mantra subjects on this site. I firmly believe truth seeking involves debate. I know many of my public health communication ideas are against current mantra and oh well....this site is not my career and we are not raising any money. I believe that telling people what to do and/or calling them names unless they comply is bad communication.

FluTrackers is Independent Media
 
Last edited:
SAE./No.200/January 2022

Studies in Applied Economics

A Literature Review and Meta-Analysis of the

Effects of Lockdowns on COVID-19 Mortality


By Jonas Herby, Lars Jonung, and Steve H. Hanke
...
Abstract

This systematic review and meta-analysis are designed to determine whether there is empirical
evidence to support the belief that “lockdowns” reduce COVID-19 mortality. Lockdowns are
defined as the imposition of at least one compulsory, non-pharmaceutical intervention (NPI).
NPIs are any government mandate that directly restrict peoples’ possibilities, such as policies that
limit internal movement, close schools and businesses, and ban international travel. This study
employed a systematic search and screening procedure in which 18,590 studies are identified
that could potentially address the belief posed. After three levels of screening, 34 studies
ultimately qualified. Of those 34 eligible studies, 24 qualified for inclusion in the meta-analysis.
They were separated into three groups: lockdown stringency index studies, shelter-in-place order
(SIPO) studies, and specific NPI studies. An analysis of each of these three groups support
the conclusion that lockdowns have had little to no effect on COVID-19 mortality.
...
Conclusions

Overall, our meta-analysis fails to confirm that lockdowns have had a large, significant effect on
mortality rates. Studies examining the relationship between lockdown strictness (based on the
OxCGRT stringency index) find that the average lockdown in Europe and the United States only
reduced COVID-19 mortality by 0.2% compared to a COVID-19 policy based solely on
recommendations. Shelter-in-place orders (SIPOs) were also ineffective. They only reduced
COVID-19 mortality by 2.9%.


Studies looking at specific NPIs (lockdown vs. no lockdown, facemasks, closing non-essential
businesses, border closures, school closures, and limiting gatherings) also find no broad-based
evidence of noticeable effects on COVID-19 mortality. However, closing non-essential
businesses seems to have had some effect (reducing COVID-19 mortality by 10.6%), which is
likely to be related to the closure of bars.
Also, masks may reduce COVID-19 mortality, but
there is only one study that examines universal mask mandates.
The effect of border closures,
school closures and limiting gatherings on COVID-19 mortality yields precision-weighted
estimates of -0.1%, -4.4%, and 1.6%, respectively. Lockdowns (compared to no lockdowns) also
do not reduce COVID-19 mortality.
...
Discussion
...
Policy implications

In the early stages of a pandemic, before the arrival of vaccines and new treatments, a society
can respond in two ways: mandated behavioral changes or voluntary behavioral changes. Our
study fails to demonstrate significant positive effects of mandated behavioral changes
(lockdowns). This should draw our focus to the role of voluntary behavioral changes.
Here, more
research is needed to determine how voluntary behavioral changes can be supported. But it
should be clear that one important role for government authorities is to provide information so
that citizens can voluntarily respond to the pandemic in a way that mitigates their exposure.

Finally, allow us to broaden our perspective after presenting our meta-analysis that focuses on
the following question: “What does the evidence tell us about the effects of lockdowns on
mortality?” We provide a firm answer to this question: The evidence fails to confirm that
lockdowns have a significant effect in reducing COVID-19 mortality. The effect is little to none.


The use of lockdowns is a unique feature of the COVID-19 pandemic. Lockdowns have not been
used to such a large extent during any of the pandemics of the past century. However, lockdowns
during the initial phase of the COVID-19 pandemic have had devastating effects. They have
contributed to reducing economic activity, raising unemployment, reducing schooling, causing
political unrest, contributing to domestic violence, and undermining liberal democracy.
These
costs to society must be compared to the benefits of lockdowns, which our meta-analysis has
shown are marginal at best. Such a standard benefit-cost calculation leads to a strong conclusion:
lockdowns should be rejected out of hand as a pandemic policy instrument.

...
https://sites.krieger.jhu.edu/iae/fi...-Mortality.pdf
 
TASS News Agency joins Reuters Connect

JUNE 1, 2020 4:01 AM

By Reuters Staff

Reuters today announced that TASS, the Russian news agency, has become a partner on its award-winning digital content marketplace, Reuters Connect here.

TASS tass.com/ is the largest Russian news agency and one of the largest news agencies worldwide.

The partnership with Reuters Connect brings media customers access to breaking news and exclusive video; videos on the Kremlin and Russian President, Vladimir Putin, as well as feature videos and general news.

TASS joins a growing roster of 17 news agencies whose content is already available to clients on Reuters Connect – PA Media (UK), EFE (Spain), Imagine China, Aflo (Japan), Panoramic (France), Bildbryan (Scandinavia), ANI (India), ABACA PRESS (France), Bernama (Malaysia), AAP (Australia), Anadolu (Turkey), Belga News Agency (Belgium), DPA (Germany), Hans Lucas (France), Latin American News Agency (Argentina), Scanpix Baltics, SIPA (USA). ...

https://www.reuters.com/article/rpb-tass-connect-idUSKBN2381UQ
 
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