Discussion: Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS) in Wuhan has been working with bats and coronavirus for many years - DNA manipulations, cloning.... - Ja

[bertrand789]

Merci Kathy,
il y a trop de personnes qui pensent que les citoyens, ?lecteurs, ne savent pas lire. En me plongeant dans les dossiers march?s humides, j'ai ?t?, bien souvent outr? par le regard des touristes et ou des "scientifiques" touristes, qui s'imaginent aller au zoo ou pire. Je n'ai plus l'?ge de supporter ceux qui ne savent pas respecter les autres cultures.
un exemple:
http://amgar.blog.processalimentaire...endu-en-chine/
Mais, le respect de l'autre, c'est plus simple quand l'autre a du respect pour la Vie.

Vu tes capacit?s av?r?es, si tu te plonges dans le su et le fait, tu peut comprendre, que je souhaitais lors de la fermeture d'un march? humide, qu'il soit produit un vrai document. Je dis cela, car je sais qu'il existe en Chine des humains femme et homme, ? la fois , comp?tent et honn?te qui veulent prot?ger la Vie ...

Ils vont avoir quand le droit de s'exprimer ?
Je dis cela car la fermeture sans explication, c'est vraiment juste digne de tr?s petites t?tes...

Thank you Kathy,
there are too many people who think that citizens, voters, cannot read. By immersing myself in the wet markets, I was often outraged by the gaze of tourists and or "scientists" tourists, who imagine going to the zoo or worse. I am no longer old enough to bear those who do not know how to respect other cultures.

an example:
http: //amgar.blog.processalimentaire...endu-en-chine/

But, respect for the other is easier when the other has respect for Life.
Considering your proven capacities, if you immerse yourself in the knowledge and the fact, you can understand, that I wished during the closing of a wet market, that a real document be produced. I say this, because I know that there are human beings in both women and men, both competent and honest, who want to protect Life ...

When will they have the right to speak?

I say that because the closure without explanation, it's really just worthy of very small heads ...

 

[bertrand789]

Le coronavirus sort-il d’un laboratoire ? Episode 1 : la th?se du virus artificiel

https://www.lemonde.fr/sante/video/...hese-du-virus-artificiel_6039933_1651302.html

 

[Pathfinder]

EXPERT REACTION: Did COVID-19 come from a lab in Wuhan?

Publicly released: Fri 17 Apr 2020 at 1130 AEST | 1330 NZST
...
Nikolai Petrovsky is a Professor in the College of Medicine and Public Health at Flinders University. He is also Research Director, Vaxine Pty Ltd

"An extremely important but still unanswered question is what was the source of COVID-19 virus. While COVID-19 has close similarities to SARS and other bat viruses no natural virus matching to COVID-19 has been found in nature despite an intensive search to find its origins. This raises the very legitimate question of whether the COVID-19 virus might be the result of human intervention.

Certainly, our and other analyses of the genomic sequence of the virus do not reveal any artificial gene inserts that would be the hallmark of a gene jockey, genetic engineers who manipulate or even create viruses by splicing in artificial inserts into their genome. These are generally easily recognisable and hence clear signatures of human intervention in the creation of a virus. The fact that these artificial inserts are not present has been interpreted by some to mean this virus is not the result of human manipulation.

However, this logic is incorrect as there are other ways in which humans can manipulate viruses and that is caused by natural selection. What do I mean? All viruses and bacteria mutate and adapt to their environment over time, with selection of the fittest individuals for survival in that particular environment.

Take a bat coronavirus that is not infectious to humans, and force its selection by culturing it with cells that express human ACE2 receptor, such cells having been created many years ago to culture SARS coronaviruses and you can force the bat virus to adapt to infect human cells via mutations in its spike protein, which would have the effect of increasing the strength of its binding to human ACE2, and inevitably reducing the strength of its binding to bat ACE2.

Viruses in prolonged culture will also develop other random mutations that do not affect its function. The result of these experiments is a virus that is highly virulent in humans but is sufficiently different that it no longer resembles the original bat virus. Because the mutations are acquired randomly by selection there is no signature of a human gene jockey, but this is clearly a virus still created by human intervention.

My group in collaboration with other Australian researchers have been using a modelling approach to study the possible evolutionary origins of COVID-19 by modelling interactions between its spike protein and a broad variety of ACE2 receptors from many animals and humans.

This work which we will publish on a prepress server next week shows that the strength of binding of COVID-19 to human ACE2 far exceeds the predicted strength of its binding to the ACE2 of any of the other species. This points to the virus having been selected for its high binding to human ACE2. In the absence of evidence of historic human infections with this virus, which could result in such selection, this either is a remarkable coincidence or a sign of human intervention.

This, plus the fact that no corresponding virus has been found to exist in nature, leads to the possibility that COVID-19 is a human-created virus. It is therefore entirely plausible that the virus was created in the biosecurity facility in Wuhan by selection on cells expressing human ACE2, a laboratory that was known to be cultivating exotic bat coronaviruses at the time. Is so the cultured virus could have escaped the facility either through accidental infection of a staff member who then visited the fish market several blocks away and there infected others, or by inappropriate disposal of waste from the facility that either infected humans outside the facility directly or via a susceptible vector such as a stray cat that then frequented the market and resulted in transmission there to humans.

Whilst the facts cannot be known at this time, the nature of this event and its proximity to a high-risk biosecurity facility at the epicentre of the outbreak demands a full and independent international enquiry to ascertain whether a virus of this kind of COVID-19 was being cultured in the facility and might have been accidentally released."

Last updated: 17 Apr 2020 12:14pm
...
https://www.scimex.org/newsfeed/expert-reaction-did-covid-19-come-from-a-lab-in-wuhan


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Download:

• PDF only

(license)

COVID-19 e-print

Important: e-prints posted on arXiv are not peer-reviewed by arXiv; they should not be relied upon without context to guide clinical practice or health-related behavior and should not be reported in news media as established information without consulting multiple experts in the field.

[Submitted on 13 May 2020]

In silico comparison of spike protein-ACE2 binding affinities across species; significance for the possible origin of the SARS-CoV-2 virus

Sakshi Piplani, Puneet Kumar Singh, David A. Winkler, Nikolai Petrovsky

The devastating impact of the COVID19 pandemic caused by SARS coronavirus 2 (SARSCoV2) has raised important questions on the origins of this virus, the mechanisms of any zoonotic transfer from exotic animals to humans, whether companion animals or those used for commercial purposes can act as reservoirs for infection, and the reasons for the large variations in susceptibilities across animal species. Traditional lab-based methods will ultimately answer many of these questions but take considerable time. In silico modeling methods provide the opportunity to rapidly generate information on newly emerged pathogens to aid countermeasure development and also to predict potential future behaviors. We used a structural homology modeling approach to characterize the SARSCoV2 spike protein and predict its binding strength to the human ACE2 receptor. We then explored the possible transmission path by which SARSCoV2 might have crossed to humans by constructing models of ACE2 receptors of relevant species, and calculating the binding energy of SARSCoV2 spike protein to each. Notably, SARSCoV2 spike protein had the highest overall binding energy for human ACE2, greater than all the other tested species including bat, the postulated source of the virus. This indicates that SARSCoV2 is a highly adapted human pathogen. Of the species studied, the next highest binding affinity after human was pangolin, which is most likely explained by a process of convergent evolution. Binding of SARSCoV2 for dog and cat ACE2 was similar to affinity for bat ACE2, all being lower than for human ACE2, and is consistent with only occasional observations of infections of these domestic animals. Overall, the data indicates that SARSCoV2 is uniquely adapted to infect humans, raising questions as to whether it arose in nature by a rare chance event or whether its origins lie elsewhere.​

...
https://arxiv.org/abs/2005.06199v1

 

[Pathfinder]

NEWS FEATURE 04 MAY 2020

Profile of a killer: the complex biology powering the coronavirus pandemic
...
The origin of SARS-CoV-2 is still an open question (see ‘Family of killers’). The virus shares 96% of its genetic material with a virus found in a bat in a cave in Yunnan, China4 — a convincing argument that it came from bats, say researchers. But there’s a crucial difference. The spike proteins of coronaviruses have a unit called a receptor-binding domain, which is central to their success in entering human cells. The SARS-CoV-2 binding domain is particularly efficient, and it differs in important ways from that of the Yunnan bat virus, which seems not to infect people5.
...
Power spikes

SARS-CoV-2 is uniquely equipped for forcing entry into cells. Both SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 bind with ACE2, but the receptor-binding domain of SARS-CoV-2 is a particularly snug fit. It is 10–20 times more likely to bind ACE2 than is SARS-CoV9. Wendtner says that SARS-CoV-2 is so good at infecting the upper respiratory tract that there might even be a second receptor that the virus could use to launch its attack.

Even more troubling is the fact that SARS-COV-2 seems to make use of the enzyme furin from the host to cleave the viral spike protein. This is worrying, researchers say, because furin is abundant in the respiratory tract and found throughout the body. It is used by other formidable viruses, including HIV, influenza, dengue and Ebola to enter cells. By contrast, the cleavage molecules used by SARS-CoV are much less common and not as effective.

The simulations driving the world’s response to COVID-19

Scientists think that the involvement of furin could explain why SARS-CoV-2 is so good at jumping from cell to cell, person to person and possibly animal to human. Robert Garry, a virologist at Tulane University in New Orleans, Louisiana, estimates that it gives SARS-CoV-2 a 100–1,000 times greater chance than SARS-CoV of getting deep into the lungs. “When I saw SARS-CoV-2 had that cleavage site, I did not sleep very well that night,” he says.

The mystery is where the genetic instructions for this particular cleavage site came from. Although the virus probably gained them through recombination, this particular set-up has never been found in any other coronavirus in any species. Pinning down its origin might be the last piece in the puzzle that will determine which animal was the stepping stone that allowed the virus to reach humans.

...
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01315-7

 

[bertrand789]

prior:
If what follows is a criticism of scientists, I am in no way against science, when its management is up to the subjects treated. At this stage, what seems important is to analyze the management problems that have allowed this situation which should not happen again for this agent or others. For a European, we are facing an American-Chinese disaster. A disaster, linked to the handling, in terms of management, of a desirable concept: ONE HEALTH, in a wrongful way and or worse (some are in prison).

Synergistic China – US Ecological Research is Essential for Global Emerging Infectious Disease Preparedness

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10393-020-01471-2

It seems to me more and more a situation of co-responsibility, unique and completely original. The politicians, at the highest level, when the dossier was presented to them took many decisions, but never had the co-discourse allowing them to recreate confidence.

The intentions were good, on both sides, the means implemented, impressive. The means implemented shock the actors on the ground in many places, because they never have and will never have the means of what has been done. Those interested in history know that the implementation of a concept of this importance cannot be done without accident. These are just human actions. Those who know a little bit about national laws know that the adaptations of national laws to implement this type of concept are enormous and will take many years ...

An accountant could write that the result, and therefore the political, image, human and financial costs are worth the investment and mistakes, and therefore inconceivable for many humans. The communication costs incurred to control the image, in fact, will only increase the costs ... And the more the file is informed, the worse it will be.

If I thought that the ONE HEALTH concept could be the solution, as it is, most certainly the cause, it seems important to me that the neutral analysis of management problems be produced by the two actors. As it cannot be imposed on either, it is to be hoped that they will become aware that controlling costs, all costs, of this crisis is an absolute necessity at this stage.

Those who imagine they can empower one or the other dream. On the other hand, if these two actors do not do the right thing, so that errors on both sides are admitted, formalized and made public and that decisions of better control, which can only be national, are taken and implemented and will remain so, the future will be bleak, in particular for the scientists who are going to come out of this crisis, with an image so bad that the funding will take a hell of a mess ...

It was due to good intentions on both sides, but with serious management errors, the most serious attack of the ONE HEALTH concept, when it is desirable ...

This message is written because the end of crisis investigation will be, given the commitments, in particular from China. As waiting, only increases costs, all the costs, nothing can be done to reduce the production time of what is going to be ...


pr?alable :
si ce qui va suivre est une critique de scientifiques, je ne suis aucunement contre la science, quand son management est ? la hauteur des sujets trait?s.


A ce stade, ce qui semble important c'est d'analyser les troubles de management qui ont permis cette situation qui ne doit pas se reproduire pour cet agent ou d'autres. Pour un europ?en, nous sommes face ? un d?sastre am?ricano-chinois. Un d?sastre, li? au maniement , en terme de management, d'un concept souhaitable : ONE HEALTH , d'une mani?re fautive et ou pire ( certains sont en prison ) .
Synergistic China–US Ecological Research is Essential for Global Emerging Infectious Disease Preparedness

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10393-020-01471-2

Cela me semble de plus en plus une situation de co-responsabilit?, unique et tout ? fait originale. Les politiques, au plus haut niveau, quand le dossier leur a ?t? pr?sent? ont pris de nombreuses d?cisions, mais sans jamais avoir le co-discours permettant de r?cr?er la confiance.

Les intentions ?taient bonnes, des deux cot?s, les moyens mis en œuvre, impressionnant. Les moyens mis en œuvre choquent les acteurs de terrain de bien des lieux,car ils n'ont et n'aurons jamais les moyens de ce qui a ?t? fait . Ceux qui s'int?ressent ? l'histoire savent que la mise en œuvre de concept de cette importance, cela ne peut se faire sans accident. Ce ne sont que des actions humaines. Ceux qui connaissent un peu les droits nationaux savent que les adaptations des droits nationaux pour mettre en oeuvre ce type de concept sont ?normes et demanderons bien des ann?es...

Un comptable pourrait ?crire que le r?sultat, donc les co?ts politiques, d'image, humains et financiers sont, ? la hauteur, des investissements et des erreurs, donc inconcevable pour bien des humains. Les frais de communication engag?s pour ma?triser l'image, en fait, ne vont qu'augmenter les co?ts... Et plus le dossier sera ?clair?, pire, cela va ?tre.

Si je pensais que le concept ONE HEALTH pouvait ?tre la solution, comme il est, tr?s certainement la cause, il me semble important que l'analyse neutre des probl?mes de management soit produite par les deux acteurs. Comme cela ne peut ?tre impos? ni ? l'un, ni ? l'autre, il faut esp?rer qu'ils vont prendre conscience que la maitrise des co?ts, de tous les co?ts, de cette crise est une n?cessit? absolue ? ce stade.

Ceux qui imaginent pouvoir responsabiliser l'un ou l'autre r?vent. En revanche, si ces deux acteurs ne font pas ce qui se doit, pour que les erreurs des deux cot?s soient admises , formalis?es et rendues publiques et que les d?cisions de meilleure ma?trise, qui ne peuvent qu'?tre nationale, sont prise et en œuvre et vont le rester, l'avenir va ?tre sombre, en particulier pour les scientifiques qui vont sortir de cette crise, avec une image tellement mauvaise que les financements vont prendre une sacr?e gamelle ...

C'est suite ? de bonnes intentions, de part et d'autre, mais avec de graves erreurs de management, la plus grave attaque du concept ONE HEALTH , alors qu'il est souhaitable ...

Ce message est ?crit car l'enqu?te de fin de crise va ?tre, vu les engagements, notamment de la Chine. Comme attendre, ne fait qu'augmenter les co?ts, tous les co?ts, rien ne peut ?tre fait pour r?duire le d?lai de production de ce qui va ?tre ...

 

[Kathy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdYDL_RK--w

Peter Daszak on December 9, 2019 (28:17): we went to Southern China and did surveillance of bats across Southern China and we have now found after six, seven years of doing this over 100 new SARS-related coronaviruses, very close to SARS. Some of them get into human cells in the lab, some of them can cause SARS disease in humanized mice models and are untreatable with therapeutic monoclonals, and you cannot vaccinate against them.

Anyone of those can become pandemic. You can manipulate them in the lab pretty easily (30:00) is just the spike protein who drives a lot of what happens with the coronavirus zoonotic risk. You can get the sequence, you can build the protein. We worked with Ralph Baric at UNC who did this, insert into a backbone of another virus and do some work in the lab. So, you can get more predictive when you find a sequence. If you are going to develop a vaccine for SARS people are going to use pandemic SARS, but let’s try to insert some of these others and get a better vaccine.

If you want to know more on Racaniello (who did the interview), please have a look here:

Commentary

Moving beyond metagenomics to find the next pandemic virus

Vincent Racaniello

PNAS March 15, 2016 113 (11) 2812-2814; https://doi.org/10.1073/pnas.1601512113

 

[bertrand789]

In the first link, he explains his modes of operation, without any real framework, on purpose, and above all he assumes his responsibility for the Chinese part. He also confirms an important point: he is not a scientist.

Of course if a scientist is the one who publishes, then compels himself to submit to the eyes of others. As he admits publishing only sometimes and on selected points ...


In the second the conclusion is this:

Banning certain types of potentially risky experiments is short sighted and impedes the potential of science to improve human health. Rather than banning experiments, such as those described by Menachery et al. (2), measures should be put in place to allow their safe conduct. In this way science’s full benefits for society can be realized, unfettered by artificial boundaries.
And as I suppose that the management of this type of structure is organized in such a way that the fact is not accessible, to those who should.

He is therefore a bad scientist and a bad manager: the total ...

Obviously there are the respectables and all the others ...

https://www.arte.tv/fr/videos/078143...les-genes-1-2/

 

[sharon sanders]

Again - a denial - this one from the Wuhan Institute of Virology. There is always the China CDC lab in Wuhan to consider. I think the live bats collected from all over China were housed at the Wuhan China CDC lab.


CGTN Exclusive: Director of Wuhan Institute of Virology says 'let science speak'
Updated 23:34, 23-May-2020

snip

Many people might misunderstand that since our institute reported the RaTG-13's genomic similarity to SARS-CoV-2, we must have the RaTG-13 virus in our lab. In fact, that's not the case. When we were sequencing the genes of this bat virus sample, we got the genome sequence of the RaTG-13 but we didn't isolate nor obtain the live virus of RaTG-13. Thus, there is no possibility of us leaking RaTG-13.

snip

After many years of research, Professor Shi and her team have isolated and obtained some coronaviruses from bats. Now we have three strains of live viruses. One of them has the highest similarity, 96 percent to the SARS virus. But their highest similarity to SARS-CoV-2 only reaches 79.8 percent.

more..

https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-05-2...t4Y/index.html

 

[bertrand789]

Pourquoi douter des propos de cette femme, je n'ai pas pour habitude de traiter une personne de menteuse, sans preuve. Ce serait ?tre d'une in?l?gance, que je n'appr?cie pas. Mais, je peut dire, que vu ses capacit?s, et, ? ce stade, de la crise, si elle ne dit que cela, c'est d?solant. Parce que si la directrice d'un tel institut, dans un tel pays, avec une crise qui a tu? autant de personne dans son pays , comme ailleurs, ne peut que dire cela, ou n'a que cela ? dire, franchement, cela donne de ce pays, une image de tr?s petit ou tr?s mauvais joueur, ce qu'il n'est pas ...

En revanche, pour ceux qui suivent, la communication de crise, depuis des ann?es, c'est lumineux...

 

[sharon sanders]

Gao Fu: No virus was extracted from animal samples from the South China Seafood Market in Wuhan or the victim unit

May 25, 2020 22:51 Observer Network
515
　　Original title: Gao Fu: The South China Seafood Market in Wuhan may be the victim unit, and no virus has been extracted from animal samples

　　(Observer Network News) On the 25th, Gao Fu, member of the National Committee of the Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference and director of the National Center for Disease Control, accepted an interview with Phoenix Satellite Television and introduced the domestic virus tracing progress and the investigation of the South China Seafood Wholesale Market in Wuhan.

　　Gao Fu said that he had personally collected some specimens in Wuhan in early January. Viruses were not detected in the extracted animal samples, but viruses were detected in environmental samples including sewer wastewater.

　　Gao Fu said, "Maybe the earliest, we speculate that there may be a seafood market, but now it seems that the seafood market itself is also a victim unit, before this virus has existed." Gao Fu emphasized that scientists should be given time to do professional research.
　　　

　　Gao Fu said that the Chinese government and scientists have been working hard to trace the source of the new coronavirus and have been carrying out related work. The new coronavirus has the characteristics of cross-species transmission. However, as of now, the intermediate host of the new coronavirus has not been found.

　　In terms of source tracing or it may take time, Gao Fu said, "The new crown virus has overturned many of our cognitions. A lot of our knowledge accumulation can't move," and a lot of the unrest has come. "

　　For some time, the source of the new coronavirus has not yet been clarified. Some politicians in the United States and other countries have spread the rumors of "Wuhan virus" and "Chinese virus", claiming to conduct a political investigation of the source of the new coronavirus in China, and even clamoring for China. Compensation. However, Wuhan first reported that the outbreak did not mean that it was the source of the virus. Virus tracing is a serious scientific problem, and it must be based on science and studied by scientists and medical experts.

　　At the same time, China is not opposed to conducting a comprehensive assessment of the international epidemic situation. My Foreign Ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian said on the 19th that China supports a comprehensive assessment of the global response to the epidemic after the global epidemic has been brought under control, summing up experience and making up for deficiencies. This work requires a scientific and professional attitude, requires WHO to lead, and adheres to the principle of objectivity and fairness.

　　Gao Fu also said this time that China is willing to cooperate with countries around the world on the issue of virus tracing.

https://news.sina.com.cn/c/2020-05-2...1&tj=none&tr=9

 

[gsgs]

they may already have found the source (with all that activity going on)

and are waiting for a politically suitable moment to release it.

 

[bertrand789]

si cela ?tait possible de lui transmettre ceci, cela pourrait faire avancer les choses.

pr?alable :

ce texte est ?crit par quelqu'un qui n'aime pas du tout cela :

Synergistic China - US Ecological Research is Essential for Global Emerging Infectious Infectious Preparedness​

https://link.springer.com/article/10...93-020-01471-2
et qui se souvient, tr?s bien, des propos et comportements des am?ricains, dans le cadre de la maladie de la vache folle ... On pourrait aussi parler des influenzas des dindes sauvages am?ricaines...
De mon point de vue, les ?tudes ne doivent pas se faire dans le cadre de l'O.M.S pour des probl?mes d'?go. Ce ne serait qu'une technique de joueur d'?chec, les m?decins ayant une tendance maladive ? se prendre pour des fous au lieu de rester des pions. Ce me semblerait plus efficient que le lieu de ce type d'?tude soient, la banque mondiale: un lieu en dehors des cadres corporatistes, mais aussi un lieu, ou l'on sait mieux regarder les probl?mes de management.

Bien s?r, ? ce niveau, le monde des finances, doit se mettre au service, de l'?tude, pour produire les faits ?clairant. Il me semble que le co?t de ce type de crise peut justifier cela .

Ceci ne veut pas dire qu'au niveau de l'O.M.S, il ne doit pas y avoir une d?marche retour d'exp?rience pour la partie humaine. En tout cas, c'est une vraie obligation, avant d'introduire, ce qui est pr?vu la m?decine traditionnelle chinoise, au niveau de l'O.M.S. Je dis cela , car si, ? ce stade, cette m?decine n'a pas vraiment brill?, l'autre franchement, voir par exemple la derni?re ?tude du LANCET , c'est d?solant .

Le joueur de Go, dirait que, pour regarder, par exemple, les ?levages des visons, ce sont des v?t?rinaires qui doivent faire le travail, et les m?decins et les agronomes qui doivent se mettre ? leur service. Cela les chinois ont bien plus de chance de pouvoir le comprendre, que les am?ricains.

Je ne souhaite pas traduire ce texte, ( les artistes de ce lieu savent bien mieux faire ), je n'aime vraiment pas la langue am?ricaine, pardon anglaise, pardon soit disant scientifique. En revanche, comme hier, j'ai fait cette requ?te :

https://chine.in/mandarin/dictionnai....php?q=rancune
je suis s?r que j'aurai pris, un tr?s grand plaisir ? maitriser cette langue dans toutes ses dimensions ...

 

[Emily]

I'm leaning towards the evolution and spread theory in Pathfinder's post below. The real failure of science and public health policy here would be that when this study, https://www.nature.com/articles/nm.3985, was done there was no recommendation to close down the bat caves to all risky activities, including ecological sampling. Sharon posted that a nature reserve in southern China was closed after the pandemic was started. That should have happened as soon as it was proved by Baric and Shi that pandemic viruses could jump directly from bats to humans and that dangerous strains were present in the caves.

I don't have any hope this disconnect between scientific discovery and practical preventive actions will improve. Virus hunters/tinkerers will continue to conclude their research papers with a pitch to do more of the same. Public health officials won't ever do more than mop up after the fact.

Tackling Rumors of a Suspicious Origin of nCoV2019

Novel 2019 coronavirus
nCoV-2019 Evolutionary History

profbillg1901
12d
SOURCE OF FURIN SITE IN SARS-CoV-2 IS COPY CHOICE ERROR FROM MIXED INFECTION OF BATS
...
Human in incubation with SARS-CoV-2 could hop a max speed train, direct line from Kunming in Yunnan Province and disembark in Wuhan train station 6.5-8 hours later, sometime last fall. The line began service in 2017.

Infected in Yunnan, does not spread it there, but goes to Wuhan, where he/she either falls ill or spreads it asymptomatically to another person, initiating the pandemic there. The initial outbreak occurs a short distance from the Wuhan train station for good reason – that is where it arrived.
...
The backbone of the virus sequence was derived from a common ancestor of Bat RaTG13 and SARS-CoV-2, most likely in Yunnan province from which Bat RaTG13 was isolated. Small segments of sequence, hundreds of nucleotides long in a genome of 30,000 nt, were derived from viruses ancestral to other viruses only recently isolated in Guangdong province.

The only laboratory in which SARS-CoV-2 was concocted was a natural one in a bat cave, in a process that took decades, an accident of nature waiting for human contact.

William R. Gallaher, Ph.D. (Harvard ’72)
Professor of Microbiology, Immunology and Parasitology, Emeritus
Louisiana State University School of Medicine, New Orleans

http://virological.org/t/tackling-rumors-of-a-suspicious-origin-of-ncov2019/384

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

And then I found this post. In the pictures, the students manipulate bats without any protection.

Translation Google

2019-07-17 11:01:19

Graduate students of the Department of Ecology participate in scientific investigations of wild animals, field behavior experiments, and collection of genetic samples

Our ecology

Field survey of bats, from Yunnan to Shenzhen

Chiroptera (commonly known as bat) is the only mammal that can really fly, with rich species and wide distribution. The developed echolocation, strong immunity, flight, longevity and other specific characteristics cast a mysterious color on the bat.

Great-footed mouse ear bat, brown fruit bat (Photographer: Zhang Libiao)

From June 18th to July 16th, 2019 , a joint research team consisting of the research team of Researcher Zhang Libiao of Guangdong Institute of Biological Resources Application and Professor Zhao Huabin, Department of Ecology, School of Life Sciences, Wuhan University The scientific investigation of bat resources was carried out, including habitat survey, predator net catching, field behavior experiment, and sample collection.

Everything is ready

It is necessary to carefully plan and prepare every time before going out into the field.


List of bat field investigation supplies


Colorful trip to Yunnan

The expedition team used a net catch method to capture bats in Dashi Cave, Lufeng County, Yunnan Province . Due to the high top of Dashidong, the steep rock cliffs are not conducive to climbing. The team members used the surrounding bamboo to extend the length of the net. In the bat's habitat (the hole) Zhang Wuwang, waiting for the bat to fly out.

The entrance of Dashidong and the opening of the pole (Photo: Xie Huanwang)

Under the leadership of Researcher Zhang Libiao, he inspected the surrounding villages of the bat habitat and selected a suitable place for behavioral experiments. The team members built a shed (7m ? 2.5m ? 2.5m) near the bat habitat.

Sheds with seam nets and behavior experiments (Photograph: Wang Junhua , Xie Huanwang)

Shenzhen trip

In the Yangtai Mountain of Shenzhen, the team members traveled the mountains and waded in search of the bat's habitat, Mahom Cave . Ma Hom hole position close to the top of the mountain sheep Taishan, need to walk about 30 minutes on foot hiking trail to reach the cave year-round habitat for a large shoe bat ( Hipposideros armiger ) .

Climbing trails, walking through the jungle (Photo: Xie Huanwang)

Mahom Cave, Honeycomb at the entrance (Photo: He Xiangyang , Xie Huanwang)

The team members looked for a suitable habitat in Zhang Shan . The location of Zhangwang is generally selected in the bat habitat (holes, under trees, etc.) and bat predation areas (watersides, grasslands, forest roads, etc.).

Find a suitable habitat, Zhang Wang (Photograph: Wang Junhua)

Xie Huanwang, a graduate student of ecology in the Department of Ecology, is looking for a suitable habitat and organizing the copy net (Photo: Zhang Libiao)

After dark, the bats went out for food. The team members waited for the bat to hit the net, promptly removed the bat and put it in the cloth bag, and brought it back indoors to sample the wing membrane overnight, and then released the bat.

Untie the net and bag the bat (Photo: Liu Quansheng , Liu Yuhang)

Xie Huanwang, sampling with big yellow bat and wing membrane (Photograph: Wang Junhua , Xie Huanwang)

After a month, this joint scientific expedition was successfully concluded. During the expedition investigation into bat species have large Myotis ( Myotis ricketti ) , large myotis ( Myotis chinensis ) , a large shoe bat ( Hipposideros armiger ) , Chinese rufous horseshoe bat ( Rhinolophus sinicus ) , in Rhinolophus ( affinis Rhinolophus ), Markov horseshoe bat ( Rhinolophus marshalli ) , rhubarb bat ( Scotophilus heathi ) , small yellow bat ( Scotophilus Kuhli ) , Pipistrellus ( Pipistrellus abramus ) , cranial flat bat ( Tylonycteris pachypus ) , Cynopterus ( Cynopterus Sphinx ) , Brown fruit bat ( Rousettus leschenaultii ), Cave nectar bat ( Eonycteris spelaea ) , fruit bats hold the tail ( Rousettus amplexicaudatus ) , a Brookfield cone bat ( Sphaerias blanfordi ) 15 kinds of bats.


Dog bat, big yellow bat, and medium chrysanthemum bat (Photo: Xie Huanwang)

https://wemp.app/posts/41b8ab05-0aec-4084-b19d-98a3bad1f571

 

[bertrand789]

@Emilie, j'ai ?crit ce qui suit hier, ce me semble normal de le mettre aussi ici. Je pourrai le faire en message direct, mais ce serait une erreur:

morale:

Si la communication est ? consid?rer comme un art, pour entrevoir vraiment cela, que de meilleur lieu, que celui qui a la plus belle collection d'artistes que j'ai pu rencontrer de ma vie ...

 

[Pathfinder]

I do not want offend anybody, but from a European point of view, it looks like that China is accusing USA and USA is accusing China.

If there was a common project on coronavirus manipulation that went wrong, it might partially explain it. But this is just a speculation.

It gets now more complicated to track where the virus really came. Not the Fish Market but the Military Games in October 2019 in Wuhan seem to have spread the virus all over the world.

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3932712

Was it already in Wuhan at that time, or was one of the teams infected? We should look back to possible SARS-CoV-2 infections in summer 2019 in all the countries involved in the games.

COVID-19 disinformation being spread by Russia, China, say experts


Questions about the origin of the virus are driving conspiracy theories

Elizabeth Thompson, Katie Nicholson, Jason Ho ? CBC News ? Posted: May 26, 2020 4:00 AM ET | Last Updated: May 26
...
Both China and Russia are promoting the narrative that democracies are failing and lack the capacity or will to fight the pandemic, while claiming that they are doing a better job at searching for a cure and helping other countries with their pandemic measures.

China's social media misinformation and disinformation efforts are more recent, he said, and are more focused on refuting suggestions that China is to blame for the pandemic.
...
"They'll simply buy one hundred thousand fake accounts, set them all up at once and get them retweeting or get them to push out content."

"The thing that's really surprised us is the volume of content that those governments produce in English," he said. "So at the moment, they can reach almost a billion social media user accounts a week with English language content that is across Instagram and Twitter and Facebook and Reddit."
...
Nehring said he's also seeing key differences between Beijing and Moscow when it comes to disinformation strategy. China is trying to rewrite the narrative, he said, by suggesting that U.S. army officers brought the virus to Wuhan during military games in December — but Kremlin-controlled media outlets appear to be trying to prolong the pandemic outside of Russia.

...
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/cov...hina-1.5583961

 

[sharon sanders]

I am seeing the above in all the China papers I check. Huge campaign being implemented for the Chinese people to read. Every day.

 

[JJackson]

I don't have any hope this disconnect between scientific discovery and practical preventive actions will improve. Virus hunters/tinkerers will continue to conclude their research papers with a pitch to do more of the same. Public health officials won't ever do more than mop up after the fact.

Emily I think this kind of field research should be much more wide spread and better funded. Without it we have no idea what range of pathogens are brewing in the wild animal population. Bats, birds, ticks and primates all need continuous monitoring so when HIV, Nipah, Hendra, Ebola, Flu, CoVs and disease X do emerge they do not come out of the blue but we have some clue that they were there. Serology testing on humans and other animals in the locality should also be being performed so we know which diseases are making tentative efforts at zoonosis even if they are not quite ready to causes a pandemic. With this data we may be able to produce anti-virals or therapeutics which are broadly effective against the range of most likely zoonotic candidates. At present we have very little idea what might be a candidate until we are dealing with a potential pandemic at which point the the public health officials can only mop up the aftermath and wait for vaccines and drugs which will not arrive until the disease has already done its damage. Each of the diseases I listed provide ample evidence that we had no idea what was coming and were totally unprepared when it did. Shi, Ralph Baric, Ian Lipkin, The EcoHealth alliance et. al. should be the heroes of the public health services and HCWs as they are in the best position to save them, and the rest of us, from terrible but avoidable grief. This is the One Health ethos and solution.

 

[Kathy]

I personally do not feel very comfortable knowing that all possible viruses from wildlife are brought to labs never 100% sure from leaks and genetically modified with gain of function studies in order to make vaccines and drugs that we might never use. I would rather spend money in nature conservation and leave bats and other wild life as much as possible in peace.

What did we get from 20 years research on SARS? I really hope that the resut was not SARS.2

 

[Kathy]

A video on gain of functions experiments. Style and music might not be the best choice but the contents are interesting, mostly to put in discussion if a lab origin of SARS-CoV-2 can be really ruled out and the danger of gain of functions experiments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...ature=emb_logo

 

[Emily]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrap...e-china-lab-in-focus-of-coronavirus-outbreak/

China Lab In Focus Of Coronavirus Outbreak
Kenneth Rapoza Senior Contributor Markets
“I don’t think it’s a conspiracy theory. I think it’s a legitimate question that needs to be investigated and answered,” Xiao Qiang, a research scientist at the School of Information at the University of California at Berkeley told Rogin. “To understand exactly how this originated is critical knowledge for preventing this from happening in the future.”

China has not been forthcoming about the new SARS coronavirus origins. They’re not being entirely transparent, despite being heralded as such by some leaders.
...
Worth noting, at least one young researcher from the lab —Huang Yanling — a graduate student rumored to be patient zero — was scrubbed from the lab’s website.

A grad student might be doing work organizing new samples or caring for bats not yet known to be dangerous.