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Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

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  • Obligatory vacination for France in autumn


    The Pasteur institute declared that all people should get vaccinated against H1N1

    I have read in a other site that French people should fight for their right of liberty of choice...

    In Canada, no vaccine is staturory. In the States?


    http://www.agoravox.fr/tribune-libre...but_forums=100

    e professeur Sylvie van der Werf, directeur d'une unit? de recherches ? l'Institut Pasteur, estime que toute la population devra ?tre vaccin?e contre le nouveau virus A/H1N1 d?s que le vaccin, en cours de pr?paration, sera disponible. "Nous sommes face ? un virus nouveau. Nous sommes au bord de la phase 6 d'alerte pand?mique de l'Organisation mondiale de la sant?", rappelle Mme van der Werf, dans un entretien au Figaro, jeudi 4 mai. "Je n'imagine pas une seconde que la diffusion s'arr?te et que ce nouveau virus disparaisse comme par enchantement", estime cette sp?cialiste des virus ? Pasteur, centre national de r?f?rence pour la grippe en r?gion Nord.
    Sur le m?me sujet


    "Nous allons ?tre conduits ? vacciner tout le monde, au Nord, comme au Sud, dans les pays riches comme dans ceux en voie de d?veloppement. Et mon avis est que le plus vite sera le mieux, compte tenu de l'?volution actuelle", ajoute-t-elle. "Mais il y a des d?lais incompressibles", note-t-elle, pointant les essais cliniques n?cessaires pour tout nouveau vaccin, "pour v?rifier l'efficacit? et l'absence d'effets secondaires".

    "On sait que les virus grippaux mutent en permanence. Et nous ne sommes pas ? l'abri d'un changement qui augmenterait sa virulence et sa transmissibilit?", estime Mme van der Werf. Les chercheurs sont en train de r?pertorier toutes les mutations "dangereuses" possibles, explique-t-elle. "Nous redoutons aussi des r?assortiments g?n?tiques entre ce virus et ceux de la grippe saisonni?re, et notamment avec un autre H1N1 majoritairement r?sistant au Tamiflu".

    Le virus A(H1N1) continue de gagner du terrain : tous les continents sont d?sormais affect?s par la grippe porcine, qui a contamin? pr?s de 20 000 personnes. Mardi, le num?ro deux de l'Organisation mondiale de la sant? (OMS), le Dr Keiji Fukuda, a averti que le monde "se rapproche" d'une alerte pand?mique maximum de grippe porcine A(H1N1) de niveau six.
    http://www.lemonde.fr/planete/articl...2061_3244.html

  • #2
    Re: Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

    sillynameflu may replace seasonal H1N1 or even H3N2,
    shouldn't we support that process instead of interrupting it ?
    I'm interested in expert panflu damage estimates
    my current links: http://bit.ly/hFI7H ILI-charts: http://bit.ly/CcRgT

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

      Originally posted by WTB View Post
      The Pasteur institute declared that all people should get vaccinated against H1N1

      I have read in a other site that French people should fight for their right of liberty of choice...

      In Canada, no vaccine is staturory. In the States?
      I have a problems with obligatory vaccination. Sometimes the cure can worse than the disease - especially if a money focused corporate drug maker has a LOT of money at stake, and tied to a timeline delivery.

      I'm sorry - there is no argument in the world that would make me trust "safety statements" of a rushed vaccine, issued by any global authority or vaccine producer. THAT level of credibility has been destroyed.

      WITH THAT SAID..... I would have to look hard at the facts on the ground AT THE TIME a vaccine was released before making a 100% statement that I would not take the vaccine.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

        Thanks WTB. In the U.S. some vaccinations are required in most cases for children to attend school. The military requires some vaccinations also.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

          Originally posted by Florida1 View Post
          In the U.S. some vaccinations are required in most cases for children to attend school. The military requires some vaccinations also.
          I found the following page, which is FULL of quotes from U.S. Governmental & Military Leaders, absolutely fascinating...... the discussion revolving primarily around the issue of mandatory anthrax vaccinations. Different target, but the issue of "all vaccines assumed to be safe" remains relevant, and these quotes give reminder that it isn't always wise to blindly assume that just because a vaccine exists.... that it is safe.

          The Military Vaccine Resource Directory - Leaders Speak Out


          Presidential Candidate George W. Bush, US Medicine. Sep. 2000:
          "The Defense Department's Anthrax Immunization Program has raised numerous health concerns and caused fear among the individuals whose lives it touches. I don't feel the [Clinton] administration's anthrax immunization program has taken into account the effect of this program on the soldiers in our military and their families. Under my administration, soldiers and their families will be taken into consideration."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Presidential Candidate Sen. John McCain, San Diego Union Tribune. Feb. 26, 2000:
          "I think that there should be a pause. I think that they have not done the job in educating the members of the military, and I would pause and I would get the best scientific and medical people together and make a better argument than they've made ... I'm not saying that I know enough to say that it should never be, but right now members of the armed services, the Guard and reserves are not accepting it."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Defense Secretary Rumsfeld, Pentagon News Briefings, Oct. 18, 2001:
          "We're going to try and save it. There have been other efforts that have failed over a period of years. And it may or may not be savable ... it's not very well underway, as you point out ... they have not been approved by the FDA, as I understand it. They do not have what looks to be -- well, I shouldn't be characterizing a private entity that way, but things have not been going swimmingly for them ..."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Defense Secretary Rumsfeld, Pentagon News Briefings, October 25, 2001:
          Q: Are you taking the anthrax vaccine, Mr. Secretary?
          Secretary Rumsfeld: No.
          Q: You're not being inoculated; you're not taking a series.
          Secretary Rumsfeld: No. No.
          Q: All right. No vaccine.
          Secretary Rumsfeld: No, no, no.
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Defense Secretary Rumsfeld, Pentagon News Briefings, October 28, 2001:
          Q: Okay. Mr. Secretary, have you been vaccinated against anthrax?
          Secretary Rumsfeld: No. Have you?
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Sen. Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader, CNN. Dec. 18, 2001:
          "The vaccine is a dated vaccine, it's an old vaccine. There are very real and potentially serious side effects from the vaccine and anyone who elects to receive the vaccine needs to be made aware of that. I do not recommend widespread inoculation for people with the vaccine in the Hart Building ...There are too many side effects and if there is limited chance of exposure the side effects would far outweigh any potential advantage."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Al Gore, Presidential Candidate, Apr. 11, 2000:
          "I feel the concerns are genuine. I also know that sometimes concerns of this sort are based on confusing data that is hard to interpret. But based on the concerns I have heard from military personnel directly, I think we are justified in taking a closer look -- I think that some increased sensitivity to the kinds of questions that are being raised is needed."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Stephen Hadley, Bush administration Deputy National Security Advisor, PBS NewsHour, Sept. 2000:
          "The vaccination program is a very serious issue. Maintaining the trust and confidence of our men and women in uniform is critical to the future of our armed forces. Some months ago, Governor Bush called for the Commander-in-Chief and our military leaders to be very mindful of the concerns of our men and women in uniform and their families about the vaccine, and called for the government to do more to address their concerns. Hopefully the [Clinton] administration will respond."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Senator Tom Daschle and Rep. Dick Gephardt, Joint letter by Congress' Majority leadership:
          "Dear Secretary Rumsfeld: As you continue your strategic review of the Defense Department's strategy and policies, we write to express our interest in and concern about reports regarding the Pentagon's continued use of an anthrax vaccine on our military personnel. ... As a result, we are troubled by several reports and actions that raise questions about whether continuing to administer the current anthrax vaccine is in the best interests of our personnel. ... "
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Senator Mike Crapo, February 24th, 2000 letter to the Secretary of Defense:
          "Dear Mr. Secretary [Cohen]: I have reviewed the preliminary report of the House Government Reform Subcommittee regarding the Department of Defense (DoD) Anthrax Vaccine Immunization Program (AVIP). I am concerned that sufficient questions regarding the safety and efficacy of the program have been raised to warrant further investigation of what I believe to be a well-intended program. In the meantime, I have serious concerns about the state of opinion in the armed forces concerning the AVIP program. Ad hoc explanations concerning the vaccine production facilities have served to inflame--rather than to allay--servicemembers' and the public's concerns. Accordingly, I believe that the military branches should cease all disciplinary actions related to the anthrax vaccination program, pending a thorough review of the AVIP program and FDA approval of the BioPort production facilities."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Senator Kent Conrad, letter to President Clinton 16 Dec 1999:
          "Dear Mr. President: I write to urge you to reexamine the Department of Defense's (DoD's) policy concerning the anthrax vaccine. ... The concerns brought to my attention are legitimate, and I believe it would be appropriate for the Pentagon to seriously and thoroughly review them before the inoculation is administered to the entire United States military. The following issues warrant particular attention: - The nature of the threat. ... - Long term health impacts. - Impact on pregnancy. ... I believe this respite provides an important opportunity to reevaluate DoD's policy regarding the anthrax vaccine. ... "
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Senator Jeff Bingaman, Congressional Resolution (SR 278) statement:
          "In addition to studying the mandatory nature of the vaccines, the resolution also asks the Secretary of Defense to: - Reconsider adverse actions taken against servicemen and women on the basis of refusal to take the smallpox or anthrax vaccines. - Reevaluate, with the Intelligence community, the current threat of anthrax and smallpox attacks on our troops, in and effort to reflect current operational realities when considering the continuation of a mandatory vaccination of a mandatory vaccination program."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Representative Nancy Johnson, September 30, 1999 testimony to Congress and letter to SECDEF:
          "Suspend the mandatory aspect of the program and to reverse the dishonorable discharges of servicemen who have refused to take the vaccine ... every soldier is well aware of the dangers that come with serving in the military, but I doubt they ever expected their government would force them to take a vaccine that has unknown long-term side effects." --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Mr. Ross Perot, January 24, 2002, testimony to the Congress:
          "We're not ready, and the sooner we start, the sooner we finish. For example, on anthrax, which is--you're not going to get it done in BioPort. You are going to take care of some of these buddies. I said all I want to know is who are the investors. Nobody will tell me who are the investors in BioPort. That sounds off a big bell in my head. ... And no matter how much damage this shot does, and believe me, I have talked to all the Tigers that have been damaged, there is a group of Air Force officers who have taken this as a major mission. They had to get out of the Air Force, but, boy oh boy, they are all over it for their friends, and the medical data they have pulled together are overwhelming. It's the kind of information you keep reaching for. They just pull together everything that's been done."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Richard Blumenthal, Attorney General for the state of Connecticut, Letter to the Secretary of Defense, March 22, 2001:
          "Mandatory vaccination of troops with a biologic product not licensed for its current use violates the Federal Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act and 10 U.S.C. ᅡᄃ 1107. I call upon the DoD to cease and desist from its illegal conduct and to abandon its plans for Anthrax Vaccine inoculation of the Armed Forces. Rather, the Department of Defense should make inoculation voluntary as the United Kingdom has done, or properly invoke the President's powers as required by statute."
          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Representative Chris Shays, House National Security Subcommitte Chairman, PBS News Hour, December 23, 2003:
          "It's just really a pathetic program that is so regretful that they consider to keep going on. It just boggles my mind. ... In 1996 they applied this drug to be an investigative new drug. The FDA has not approved it. There have been no protocols to establish this program. They just basically invented this program."
          -----------------------------------------------------------------------
          I have a comment on the above comment.... Notice that is a 2003 comment, on a vaccine that 1st entered the approval process in 1996. These are NOT the sort of things you rush.
          -----------------------------------------------------------------------

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

            Originally posted by The Mountains Voice View Post
            [SIZE="3"][COLOR="Purple"]I have a comment on the above comment.... Notice that is a 2003 comment, on a vaccine that 1st entered the approval process in 1996. These are NOT the sort of things you rush.
            I really do need to clarify the above. In a serious pandemic... you don't necessarily have time to follow standard protocol. As I mentioned in an earlier post - I'd have to see the facts on the ground at the time of a vaccine prior to making a decision of whether or not to take the vaccine.

            If for instance, the current circulating strain of flu was killing a huge percentage of infected persons.... That's a pretty big factor towards taking the vaccine.

            How much the virus had officially mutated from the seed stock used to make the vaccine is another factor (as a virus mutates away from the vaccine seed stock - the vaccine loses effctiveness, which is why EVERY YEAR they have to remake the annual flu shots.)

            Early reports from vaccine safety tests would be very closely reviewed - and that also would be a deciding factor.

            But in no case do I feel the Government should take away my right to CHOOSE what I put into my body. The government (and most governments historically) has a very poor track record when it comes to being trustworthy when it comes to matters of life and death. Individuals are lost in "mass Humanity" counts, in unemotional phrases and justifications.... the most recently famous being, "necessary collateral damage".

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

              There will not be enough pandemic vaccine for the citizens of the world so I do not think most citizens need to worry about being forced to take the vaccination.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Obligatory vacination for France in autumn

                Originally posted by Florida1 View Post
                There will not be enough pandemic vaccine for the citizens of the world so I do not think most citizens need to worry about being forced to take the vaccination.
                AGREED. My point is mainly in regards to considerations individuals should take even in the event of voluntary vaccinations.

                I personally believe that plasma transfusions from persons that have survived, and have the antibodies, is something that will eventually be considered, and come more to the forefront if things spiral negatively. It is something that could be done on smaller scale, local cases - involving less "technology".

                I wish we could see more emphasis given to this consideration / discussion.

                Comment

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