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It is not ok to label all middle aged white women as "a Karen"

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  • It is not ok to label all middle aged white women as "a Karen"

    This is not acceptable. I am in the middle aged / senior white woman category. How is it ok to ever refer to me "a Karen"?

    We can not hope to be a more cohesive society if we are adding stereotypes to our culture.

  • #2
    Maybe we need a tee shirt!

    Comment


    • #3
      I think so! In this day of social progress it is divisive to perpetuate another negative stereotype as acceptable. "Karen" name calling is all over social media in the last couple of weeks and it is becoming commonplace. For those of us who were at the forefront as women left the secretarial pools for the board rooms - it is quite insulting.

      Comment


      • Mary Wilson
        Mary Wilson commented
        Editing a comment
        Actually we have seen this 'attitude' all along with this pandemic. It has been a technique used to degrade the severity of the COVID-19. We have seen it with the resistance of wearing masks, the "its only the flu", "it'll be over soon", " and hundreds of deliberate COVID-19 hacks that have been occurring in the United States.
        I wonder "who" would be so devious to attack the health of people, and why.
        Do we need to see a plastered cast to believe the bone is actually fractured?

    • #4
      The bullying and worse of women, especially older women, has been a gambit of opportunistic cowards for far longer than I have been alive. It also shuts down reasonable debates, but so does assuming that differences of opinions about mask wearing and disease impacts are coming from dark motives.
      Never forget Excalibur.
      “‘i love myself.’ the quietest. simplest. most powerful. revolution ever.” ---- nayyirah waheed
      Avatar: Franz Marc, Liegender Hund im Schnee 1911 (My posts are not intended as advice or professional assessments of any kind.)

      Comment


      • #5
        https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/0...ut-of-control/
        The hatred for ‘Karens’ is out of control
        The ritualistic humiliation of white women shows how poisonous identity politics has become.

        Brendan O'Neill
        Editor

        25th June 2020
        Never forget Excalibur.
        “‘i love myself.’ the quietest. simplest. most powerful. revolution ever.” ---- nayyirah waheed
        Avatar: Franz Marc, Liegender Hund im Schnee 1911 (My posts are not intended as advice or professional assessments of any kind.)

        Comment


        • #6
          If all it takes to be a "Karen" is to be a middle aged, white, woman, then perhaps 25% of the US would be Karens. Maybe more. Anyone making that assumption is clearly misusing or misunderstanding the term, perhaps intentionally.

          I've seen the term used in two main contexts:

          1. When "Karen" is using her status as a "wealthy" consumer to bully a low-wage employee for her own benefit. The stereotypical example is Karen demanding a free meal in a McDonalds because her Big Mac had too many pickles on it, or something of that nature.
          2. When "Karen" calls the police on a non-white individual for doing something routine, incorrectly reporting it as suspicious.

          Karen #1 is a bully; Karen #2 is a bigot. The state of California is considering a bill that they called the CAREN Act that actually criminalizes action #2.

          Until a couple weeks ago, I had only heard the term used in the first sense, but apparently both uses are fairly common. I am not aware of the widespread use of the term to describe ALL white women of a certain age.

          Comment


          • #7
            "The 'CAREN Act' (Caution Against Racially Exploitative Non-Emergencies) was introduced on Tuesday at a San Francisco Board of Supervisors meeting by Supervisor Shamann Walton. The ordinance's name is a twist on 'Karen,' the name social media gives people making racially biased 911 calls. And it's not just 'Karen.' There are also names like 'Becky,' which has also come to symbolize a stereotype of whiteness." link

            Comment


            • #8
              Originally posted by alert View Post
              If all it takes to be a "Karen" is to be a middle aged, white, woman, then perhaps 25% of the US would be Karens. Maybe more. Anyone making that assumption is clearly misusing or misunderstanding the term, perhaps intentionally.

              I've seen the term used in two main contexts:

              1. When "Karen" is using her status as a "wealthy" consumer to bully a low-wage employee for her own benefit. The stereotypical example is Karen demanding a free meal in a McDonalds because her Big Mac had too many pickles on it, or something of that nature.
              2. When "Karen" calls the police on a non-white individual for doing something routine, incorrectly reporting it as suspicious.

              Karen #1 is a bully; Karen #2 is a bigot. The state of California is considering a bill that they called the CAREN Act that actually criminalizes action #2.

              Until a couple weeks ago, I had only heard the term used in the first sense, but apparently both uses are fairly common. I am not aware of the widespread use of the term to describe ALL white women of a certain age.
              Karen is a name. What are the last names of Karen #1 and Karen #2, Alert? I think some people are misunderstanding, perhaps intentionally or perhaps because they are not middle-aged white women why this is wrong behavior. And making false reports is already a crime so why is it more of a crime if the reporter is white, middle-aged and heaven forbid, a WOMAN? Is it because as only 25% of the population THEY are a minority and thus perceived as easy targets? If you want to sacrifice yourself to the Karen insanity, Alert, go ahead and do it. I'm an individual and want the same rights as any other individual in this society.
              Never forget Excalibur.
              “‘i love myself.’ the quietest. simplest. most powerful. revolution ever.” ---- nayyirah waheed
              Avatar: Franz Marc, Liegender Hund im Schnee 1911 (My posts are not intended as advice or professional assessments of any kind.)

              Comment


              • #9
                Originally posted by Emily View Post

                Karen is a name. What are the last names of Karen #1 and Karen #2, Alert? I think some people are misunderstanding, perhaps intentionally or perhaps because they are not middle-aged white women why this is wrong behavior. And making false reports is already a crime so why is it more of a crime if the reporter is white, middle-aged and heaven forbid, a WOMAN? Is it because as only 25% of the population THEY are a minority and thus perceived as easy targets? If you want to sacrifice yourself to the Karen insanity, Alert, go ahead and do it. I'm an individual and want the same rights as any other individual in this society.
                Yeah, obviously it's a problem that a common name was used for these two issues, in much the same way as we object to certain types of disease naming. Could we come up with a better word for someone who does those actions than "Karen"? Probably. But in the same way that we're stuck with the name MERS for the disease caused by that coronavirus, I think we're stuck with the term Karen for those issues due to widespread use. Yeah, I've seen men act as a "Karen". (Various corners of the internet have adopted various male names that sound like "Karen" for such actions.)

                As minorities go, 25% is a very large minority of a group, especially when you're considering THREE separate criteria to join it (age, race, gender). As women outnumber men overall, it's entirely possible that group might be the largest such minority one could construct. Anyone who is using those issues to bash all middle-aged white women seems to be pretty far in the fringes.

                I think the purpose of the CAREN Act was to punish the racial motivation of the false call, not the age, race, or gender of the perpetrator.

                Comment


                • #10
                  Could we come up with a better word for someone who does those actions than "Karen"?
                  Yes, the name of the person doing something wrong.

                  As minorities go, 25% is a very large minority of a group, especially when you're considering THREE separate criteria to join it (age, race, gender).
                  No, that limits a group more. And I think that people who appear to show their first interest in human rights by supporting a demeaning sterotype like the Karen meme might ask themselves, "Could I be a touch misogynistic"? (Or ageist?)

                  As far as mature white women being stuck with the Karen because 'we' are stuck with MERS??? This 'we' is NOT a virus. You can be stuck with it, but I am not.
                  Never forget Excalibur.
                  “‘i love myself.’ the quietest. simplest. most powerful. revolution ever.” ---- nayyirah waheed
                  Avatar: Franz Marc, Liegender Hund im Schnee 1911 (My posts are not intended as advice or professional assessments of any kind.)

                  Comment


                  • #11
                    Alert - the name "Karen" is both racist and misogynist because it was a name popular in the 1950s for white female babies. It is like calling someone a "Mildred". That name conjures up a vision of an elderly white woman since that name has not been popular for white female babies since 1920s.

                    It is racist, ageist, misogynistic to use the name CAREN (specifically to mimic "Karen") for a law against racism.

                    We need less stereotyping - not more.

                    I was one of the first women professionals at a large aerospace company in the late 1970s. Women were not encouraged to speak up because the hold on progress was so tenuous that no woman wanted to call attention to herself. It felt like we were sneaking in to the party and it was important to try to be as invisible as possible while still excelling at the job. In large meetings women did not speak up on important issues. That was done privately after the meeting.

                    And when we did start to exert some opinions (in the 80s) we were privately labeled "pushy", "aggressive", "demanding" for doing the same thing male co-workers did.

                    Especially frowned on was any ambition to get promoted. Just lucky to be selected to wear a suit and be able to sit with the grown-ups at the decision makers' table once a month.

                    The Karen messaging is wrong.

                    Comment


                    • #12
                      TOP DEFINITION

                      "IAN" (male Karen)
                      A MALE VERSION OF A KAREN

                      An Ian is a middle aged white man that finds it necessary to hurl abuse at women Who beleive there is an issue with male orientated violence.

                      "IAN" (male Karen) DEFINED

                      https://www.urbandictionary.com/defi...ale%20Karen%29

                      Comment


                      • #13
                        There's something much deeper going on here.

                        Karen was one of many names that was used to describe a personality trait in memes. Kyle, Chad, Tyrone, Pepe, Becky, and many more had similar meanings. There really wasn't a racial or sexist component to any of them, and they were at most mildly insulting. But something has changed with respect to Karen, perhaps in the past few days or past few weeks, that I am still struggling to understand. If you asked me a week ago what the defining characteristic of a "Karen" was, I would have replied that a "Karen" calls the manager and then abuses the manager. The use in response to racist 911 calls was new to me. So I spent some time today wandering around the internet to find out what a "Karen" really was, and found everything imaginable being blamed on "Karens".

                        I saw memes that say Karens think vaccines cause autism. (That wouldn't be a Karen, that would be an anti-vaxxer.) I saw memes that say Karens think 5G causes COVID-19. (That's not a Karen; that's a science denier.) I saw memes that blame "Karens" for things that we clearly already have a better term for and that have nothing to do with the original use of the meme.

                        Memes can go bad. The meaning of a meme will change depending on who uses it. The Pepe The Frog meme is a good example. It went bad when fringe groups online began to use it as a symbol of white supremacy, and now it is widely considered racist and unusable. I don't think the Karen meme is coming from a political angle, however, as both parties realize this group is one of the key swing constituencies in the upcoming election. But the Karen meme seems to have gone bad nevertheless.

                        So who benefits by smearing a large group of people as Karens?

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